Safe use of anabolic steroids: is there any way?

[RebelWithACause]

I used anabolic steroids twice. I have used testosterone enanthate (250mg-500mg ranges), Dianabol and Proviron.

I am currently not interested in using them for a good while (at least 1-2 years - until I feel 100%). But for what it's worth. Who knows maybe in the future I will run a cycle again. I am not closed off from the idea.

What I like about anabolic steroids is:

1. Fast recovery from the gym. Workouts do not interfere with life because you recover quick. As I am natural again I notice especially heavy workouts (3-5 rep range) lower my motivation for doing other things. On anabolic steroids you can workout and maintain high motivation and high mental energy. Training natural does not compare.
2. High energy all day. Even in PFS I noticed physically I had high amounts of energy. You have high energy from morning to evening. I would walk faster, lift heavier, etc.
3. Muscle gains come quick and easy. It makes you look better quick. This is a big + of anabolic steroids IMO. In a sense it is a cheat code to life. Gaining muscle is extremely easy on anabolic steroids.
4. Confidence is higher. My natural confidence is good. But anabolic steroids make you more cutthroat. More intense. I like the mental aspect of it. In a sense it makes you more masculine.

Now in PFS anabolic steroids do not work as well as in a healthy person. My libido was not great while on it. I had negative thoughts while on it. I would wake up depressed especially 8 hours after injecting. Brainfog. Overall the experience mentally was not great except for the physical benefits which I liked. Confidence was still there I just did not feel that good mentally.

@Helen already warned before that taking testosterone without progesterone can cause these type of side effects.

I know anabolic steroids will make your body more imbalanced because it lowers minerals and desensitises receptors.

I am wondering what would be a "healthy" or "healthier" way to take anabolic steroids. Especially for a guy like me with a PFS background.

What would a balanced anabolic steroids cycle look like for good muscle gain, good mental feeling and high energy? And do-able on a long term basis.

Testosterone + a progestin?

Lower dosages? If so what does this look like.

Taeian Clark promotes short high dosage (1000mg for example) deca durabolin (nandrolone) cycles (6-8 weeks). No testosterone. He says guys have very little side effects (no hairloss, functional libido), a lot of muscle gain. I think they use l-taurine as PCT. But I also read @Helen saying that nandrolone only can cause same problems as finasteride. Taeian Clark is the same guy that promotes drinking a lot of tomato juice for bodybuilders.

Deca base cycle, No testosterone, No sides. - TAEIAN

"Deca shuts your testosterone down? Of course it does, all steroids do. What matters is we replace this drug with an androgen that can support our male functions. Dianabol, Deca (nandrolone), Equipoise all fit that bill. The big reason being here is they are all androgens that also convert to estrogen. Which is needed for androgens to even work on the androgen receptor period. This is why DHT drugs will not work as a base. Studies show without estrogen DHT drugs solo can make animals very timid and loss of sex drive, gain body fat and insulin resistance and even digestion goes down the drain due to estrogen being needed for pancreatic function on enzymes for digestion."

He claims testosterone + deca durabolin is the cause of high prolactin. When you use deca durabolin only you do not have prolactin issues.

I trust the people on this forums more than Taeian Clark but I do find his views interesting.

 

[Helen]

Test with progesterone= safe IMO.

Test with progestin= NOT SAFE


Nandrolones are progestins. It is like using DHT with a progestin. no reason to use them. Just use test plus progesterone. or DHT with progesterone.

Progestin cant convert to cortisol and progesterone can. that is a huge difference. that is why progestin is NOT safe.

 

[RebelWithACause]

Thank you for explaining.

How do you dose progesterone with testosterone? Is there a ratio?

 

[Helen]

Thank you for explaining.

How do you dose progesterone with testosterone? Is there a ratio?

that will depend on your hairtest. the dosages have to be ideally calibrated for a person, then this way, the steroids will be the most effective. and will cause zero sides.

 

[Trump_1776]

If you ask veteran lifters they will say it depends on body chemistry. More often than not, you still screw yourself

 

[RebelWithACause]

If you ask veteran lifters they will say it depends on body chemistry. More often than not, you still screw yourself

Hmm most guys I know just blast grams of steroids without ever figuring out their hair test and they are doing fine. I do not think most people think much when they use steroids. They just inject themselves.

That is why I like this information because you can at least mitigate some of the problems you might encounter. I do not want to fuck up my body but I am open to the risk of taking steroids for the benefits they provide. In a year or two probably. If I can lower the risks and problems then this is good.

 

[Helen]

@RebelWithACause Steroids on average are bad for you, since they still downregulate many enzymes.

There are no not harmful cycles. All cycles and most hormones are harmful.

There are no reason to use them at all. before the fin recently. I had all high steroids without taking them.

Extra steroids dont give any benefit, since all they do is just release the nitric oxide. So the more sustained release of nitric oxide you have the more vegf activation you will have, the more muscle you will build

this has not much to do with the levels of steroids. But has to do about the balace between the steroids and nitric oxide and electrolytes.

NItric oxide is a duaretic. So if you support magnesium and potassium. you will have a lot more steroids working in your body, then injecting 500mg of test a week with low levels of electrolytes. That test will simply not work at all. It will be all pissed out and bound. IMO totally worthless.


Sometimes to build muscle and to increase metabolism , dosages like 30mg or even less are given, with A LOT MORE results.

It is a SUSTAINED NITRIC Oxide relaese that you want, not like realease all of it in half hour and then sit with zero nitic oxide.

lets say test level of 500 will realease nitric oxide at certain speed, if the person has good nitric oxide then test level of 500 in blood will be releasing this nitric oxide consistantly. and this will provide the boost and muscle growth.

but if another person has 900 test levels, and lower nitric oxide availability , this person will release nitric oxide in the morning and then will sit all day with Nothing.

So as you see it is not about steroids levels at all.

Lets not make this forum about steroids. Steroids are very bad for you , since when you take them you make the body regulation and buffers work overtime.

No reason to take steroids at all, since extra steroids will not work in your body anyway

So the more electrolyte balance you hold. the more steroids your body will make. on its own.

It is not needed to take them at all. steroids will put pressure on glutathione system and will make you old.

People do the opposite, they take steroids and then wait for the body to adjust nitric oxide and glut production. In most cases it never happens. since glutathione in most case are very low


Especially if you got PFS, that means that you glutathione system is weak. so the more of shit you take the worse your liver gets.

PFS people have weak constitution. They have weak glutathione system,. they have to be very careful with the hormones or drugs.

 

[RebelWithACause]

@RebelWithACause Steroids on average are bad for you, since they still downregulate many enzymes.

There are no not harmful cycles. All cycles and most hormones are harmful.

There are no reason to use them at all. before the fin recently. I had all high steroids without taking them.

Extra steroids dont give any benefit, since all they do is just release the nitric oxide. So the more sustained release of nitric oxide you have the more vegf activation you will have, the more muscle you will build

this has not much to do with the levels of steroids. But has to do about the balace between the steroids and nitric oxide and electrolytes.

NItric oxide is a duaretic. So if you support magnesium and potassium. you will have a lot more steroids working in your body, then injecting 500mg of test a week with low levels of electrolytes. That test will simply not work at all. It will be all pissed out and bound. IMO totally worseless.


Sometimes to build muscle and to increase metabolism , dosages like 30mg or even less are given, with A LOT MORE results.

It is a SUSTAINED NITRIC Oxide relaese that you want, not like realease all of it in half hour and then sit with zero nitic oxide.

lets say test level of 500 will realease nitric oxide at certain speed, if the person has good nitric oxide then test level of 500 in blood will be releasing this nitric oxide consistantly. and this will provide the boost and muscle growth.

but if another person has 900 test levels, and lower nitric oxide availability , this person will release nitric oxide in the morning and then will sit all day with Nothing.

So as you see it is not about steroids levels at all.

Very interesting.

Since I started supplementing with potassium & magnesium my muscle have been fuller and I am strong in the gym. Now I am taking a break for a few days since I think I was overdoing it with the amount.

Before PFS and using finasteride I always had extreme high libido but also a lot of hair shedding. But my muscles looked flat. Never pumped or full. Gains in gym were also minimal even though my strength was really high. I was deadlifting 200kg but I did not look like I lifted. I looked soft but had high androgen feeling.

Now I get good pumps and muscle gain, not so much hair shedding but my libido is lower. This could be part of PFS (the libido) or it is just more balanced that I do not think about sex 24/7 anymore. I do not know.

Anyway I am seeing that hormones are not end answer. Hopefully I can optimise my body to become best it is and build good amount of muscle that way.

What do you think about creatine? Is it good tool to use or is it better to get it from meat? I eat a lot of meat but even with that you will only get 3g of creatine. Normally when you take creatine you supplement 5g.

 

[Helen]

Very interesting.

Since I started supplementing with potassium & magnesium my muscle have been fuller and I am strong in the gym. Now I am taking a break for a few days since I think I was overdoing it with the amount.

Before PFS and using finasteride I always had extreme high libido but also a lot of hair shedding. But my muscles looked flat. Never pumped or full. Gains in gym were also minimal even though my strength was really high. I was deadlifting 200kg but I did not look like I lifted. I looked soft but had high androgen feeling.

Now I get good pumps, not so much hair shedding but my libido is lower. This could be part of PFS (the libido) or it is just more balanced that I do not think about sex 24/7 anymore. I do not know.

Anyway I am seeing that hormones are not end answer. I am still interested in it but not sure if I will use them. Hopefully I can optimise my body to become best it is and build good amount of muscle that way.

What do you think about creatine? Is it good tool to use or is it better to get it from meat? I eat a lot of meat but even with that you will only get 3g of creatine. Normally when you take creatine you supplement 5g.

it is all about the balance. the more balanced you are the stronger you are.

People dont understand this, they think they can take some hormones and become stronger.

I had people taking 700 test a week. who could not run 100 meters, they were so tired from the test.

One hormone cant never make you stronger. since one hormone will always pull you into on side. lets say you have low sodium potassium ratio.

You take testosterone a little. your sodium potassium ratio gets balanced. you feel strong

but if you take more test = the sodium potassium ratio gets high and you go away too far from the ideal again. And you get weak again.

So hormones in most cases are not needed at all. Unless you have problems with balls.

since your balls are capable to produce a lot of hormones. you just need certain requirements for them to start producing those hormones.

I think it is good to just eat food. And have a nice balanced diet and always make sure you hold electrolytes.

No matter what you do , HOLD your electrolytes this will maximize your hormonal output, you will never need any hormones.

Overdoing on electrolytes are also not good.


Steady holding them is good. Create a program with electrolytes, food, like electrolytes protocol and keep taking it. and following it. and you will have the maximum hormonal output with actually those hormones working properly

People plateau in the gym since their exercise routine is too hard, and they dont hold electrolytes , this kills NO and boom no progress and they think they need hormones but they dont. they just need electrolytes support

 

[RebelWithACause]

it is all about the balance. the more balanced you are the stronger you are.

People dont understand this, they think they can take some hormones and become stronger.

I had people taking 700 test a week. who could not run 100 meters, they were so tired from the test.

One hormone cant never make you stronger. since one hormone will always pull you into on side. lets say you have low sodium potassium ratio.

You take testosterone a little. your sodium potassium ratio gets balanced. you feel strong

but if you take more test = the sodium potassium ratio gets high and you go away too far from the ideal again. And you get weak again.

So hormones in most cases are not needed at all. Unless you have problems with balls.

since your balls are capable to produce a lot of hormones. you just need certain requirements for them to start producing those hormones.

I think it is good to just eat food. And have a nice balanced diet and always make sure you hold electrolytes.

No matter what you do , HOLD your electrolytes this will maximize your hormonal output, you will never need any hormones.

Overdoing on electrolytes are also not good.


Steady holding them is good. Create a program with electrolytes, food, like electrolytes protocol and keep taking it. and following it. and you will have the maximum hormonal output with actually those hormones working properly

People plateau in the gym since their exercise routine is too hard, and they dont hold electrolytes , this kills NO and boom no progress and they think they need hormones but they dont. they just need electrolytes support

What do you mean with holding your electrolytes? Supplementing them? Or not pissing them out?

 

[Helen]

What do you mean with holding your electrolytes? Supplementing them? Or not pissing them out?

yeah supplementing. holding good levels

 

[MNK99]

-Attaining a setpoint or a homeostatic state in which the balance of electrolytes and their adequate use within our system is in an optimal range regardless of external upsets?

 

[Nina]

Very interesting.

Since I started supplementing with potassium & magnesium my muscle have been fuller and I am strong in the gym. Now I am taking a break for a few days since I think I was overdoing it with the amount.

Before PFS and using finasteride I always had extreme high libido but also a lot of hair shedding. But my muscles looked flat. Never pumped or full. Gains in gym were also minimal even though my strength was really high. I was deadlifting 200kg but I did not look like I lifted. I looked soft but had high androgen feeling.

Now I get good pumps and muscle gain, not so much hair shedding but my libido is lower. This could be part of PFS (the libido) or it is just more balanced that I do not think about sex 24/7 anymore. I do not know.

Anyway I am seeing that hormones are not end answer. Hopefully I can optimise my body to become best it is and build good amount of muscle that way.

What do you think about creatine? Is it good tool to use or is it better to get it from meat? I eat a lot of meat but even with that you will only get 3g of creatine. Normally when you take creatine you supplement 5g.

How much potassium were you taking?

 

[RebelWithACause]

How much potassium were you taking?

3000-5000mg potassium chloride + 2000mg-3000mg magnesium chloride

But sometimes I would just scoop random amount and I might have gotten more.

 

[Stud]

just take pregnenolone along side the steroids there you have your balance. bioidentical steroids are safe imo. synthetic ones are awesome feeling wise but putting something in your body that it doesn't naturally produce seems risky.
edit: i wouldn't use nandrolone

 

[MNK99]

You're too young @Stud. REACH prime... and diminishing returns... wait 3 yrs after that, then take steroids. I thought I couldn't go further, despite owning most at gym... I was wrong.
----> could def cut and get stronger/ bigger looking/ fitter looking (or whatever descriptor word one may use).
--> I mean it can be done.... but, it's not necessarily the best way to do it... and harder and harder steroids forever before you are even 20.... is not wise. Unless you are a pro bber and simply do not care, and earn money for it.... for girls?? They think biceps alone = strong. Most anyways, except other OCD, fitness-obsessed wackjobs.

 

[IHateFin]

I wonder how a low to mid test cycle plus anavar would fair? like 100 to 150mg of test plus var..
maybe use test prop 25 to 50mg E2D?
that probs wont do much for performance enhancement tho, but who knows... var is interesting.

 

[Stud]

You're too young @Stud. REACH prime... and diminishing returns... wait 3 yrs after that, then take steroids. I thought I couldn't go further, despite owning most at gym... I was wrong.
----> could def cut and get stronger/ bigger looking/ fitter looking (or whatever descriptor word one may use).
--> I mean it can be done.... but, it's not necessarily the best way to do it... and harder and harder steroids forever before you are even 20.... is not wise. Unless you are a pro bber and simply do not care, and earn money for it.... for girls?? They think biceps alone = strong. Most anyways, except other OCD, fitness-obsessed wackjobs.

fuck gym fuck fitness. i don't care about that unless you like doing that or for health reasons i don't understand why people workout. go play some sports. soccer, american football, basketball, baseball, MMA, boksing whatever. something with competition. all these fitness models david laid, jeff seid are fooking faggy. as for the steroids NO. i'm not stoppig anything and i'm not going to give in to the authoritarianism around me and forums. i take them because they benefit me in more than one way.

 

[Stud]

Most guys who take roids at 18 -20.... still can't do much. And in a fight... well they're not flexible, fast, and are stiff as boards. Unless they train all Russian style- with kettlebells and stuff, or are 7'0 like those viking - strong man and ice power lifting guys, or those guys that throw barrels over their heads (can't do that... probably very dangerous for me).

disagreed at least you got to be specific wich roids ther are major fucking differences. I think we need to adress this because people are getting fake info. Especially since @Helen also said omething similar with athletes using testosterone and gassing out quicker i believe. Testosterone is just anabolic and also a bit androgenic trough coverting to dht. I deffinitly see why this would make you slower and less flexible. however DHT is very very different and quite opposite actually. DHT makes you very strong, explosive, shortens your reaction time, and improves your stamina. don't even get me started about proviron, masteron etc. wich all stimulate the crap out of your central nervous system making you super alert, energetic, and ready for action. i have personnaly sparred on proviron just for fun though. man does it make you a beast. normal dht is worse but still good. test would probably suck.

 

[MNK99]

-I will say, despite all that above.
-He did inspire a lot of people to chase aesthetics. And that in itself is pretty good.
-He influenced a lot. He took Clen, Tren, and a lot of other stuff. It's out there.

-Dude, people that actually have gotten into fights... the winner wasn't because of roids... (fights on TV, Hockey, Olympic Boxing, Boxing, MMA, etc are different --- those guys get paid to fight, I mean a street fight or with random idiots).

-I've had friends throw randoms onto a moving car in self defense. AGGRESSION, anger... and fast thinking... --> beats roids or working out.
-Also experience, reflexes (helps a ton even if you're lanky or jacked or even fat). My reflexes are honed as are motor skills, but for me reflexes = innate.

-People can take as many steroids as they want ---> BUT: if a fight goes to the ground, even the toughest guy can be put down.
-AND: a bullet >>>>> training, and fitness anyday.
-Sorry to get so dark, just saying... awareness at all times.

-LOW INHIBITION and FEARLESSNESS helps too... most ppl will not screw with that. But those 2 qualities + STUPIDITY = early grave. --> so it's good to know what you have,
but never ever use it, unless necessary or to take down detractors.

-IF you have no fears mostly, and are full of rage... you can destroy 3 ppl at a time... it's not due to roids or lack of roids... it's something else. Passion, and other attributes.
Look at Bruce Lee or Muhammad Ali. I've scared the shyt out of ppl 8in bigger than me and on roids. And meth... they're bitches.

- @Stud just be a gentle giant.
- I am trying to keep this simple and easy to follow so you don't disagree with nonsense, but I just can't.

-tony Ja... Bruce lee... Jet Li... no steroids.
-Nor that guy from A Bittersweet LIfe, Lee Byung-Hun. Bolo Yong, no roids.
-Jesus No roids.
-Mental INTIMIDATION and mind game, manipulation is also an asset in true strength, fighting, and all that. Look at ALI terrorize his opponents psychologically.
-And TYSON? HUGE muscles, strong, jacked, but INSANE --> scared the hell out of opponents.