PFS theory ( taking into account all the data that we received., CSF values, studies , blood tests, reactions)

[Walker]

Interesting.

@Helen, for curiousity’s sake - couldn’t people run both the CDnuts protocol as well as TEI at the same time? I took a multivitamin during my whole recovery (First Orange Triad, then a whole food one) while cycling herbs and R-Andro. Wouldn’t these guys be able to just do TEI and then run the other program on top of it? Or should they be kept separate. @Cdsnuts always encouraged supplementation with minerals and such with the other pieces of the program anyway, as well as B vitamins. A lot of individuals just miss that piece and rely solely on herbs and prohormones to do everything.

Or would that hurt the balancing part? Just a thought I had - of course you’ll know much better than me in this piece of it.

 

[Helen]

Interesting.

@Helen, for curiousity’s sake - couldn’t people run both the CDnuts protocol as well as TEI at the same time? I took a multivitamin during my whole recovery (First Orange Triad, then a whole food one) while cycling herbs and R-Andro. Wouldn’t these guys be able to just do TEI and then run the other program on top of it? Or should they be kept separate. @Cdsnuts always encouraged supplementation with minerals and such with the other pieces of the program anyway, as well as B vitamins. A lot of individuals just miss that piece and rely solely on herbs and prohormones to do everything.

Or would that hurt the balancing part? Just a thought I had - of course you’ll know much better than me in this piece of it.

protocol with hormones, this that, dont balance you , thus all those people could go bald.

TEI balances your body, all of it, it has nothing to do with PFS. It gives you libido with hair. And gets rid of other problems.

Most people were already sick before Finasteride. with all kinds of stuff, thus losing hair.


I would never add anything to TEI programs. since all people are different. And TEI gives different stuff to different people.

you are either on TEI program, with hairtest. or you can go on Cdnuts herbs cycling which is kind of random and can lead you you dont know where.

Or we can come up with another more precise protocol. And try it out now.

Light at the end, and Cdnuts, got bald after they recovered. SO they are obviously far from balanced.

 

[Walker]

protocol with hormones, this that, dont balance you , thus all those people go bald.

TEI balances your body, all of it, it has nothing to do with PFS. It gives you libido with hair. And gets rid of other problems.

Most people were already sick before Finasteride. with all kinds of stuff, thus losing hair.

Right, and I get that. I was just referring to a possible accelerated tweaked program to get folks out of the PFS funk a little faster. Obviously I wouldn’t expect them to work in tandem for the overall balancing from a health perspective.

But I also am totally against the kitchen sink method of throwing everything on top of each other, so maybe simple and easy is what individuals need to stick to.

 

[Helen]

Right, and I get that. I was just referring to a possible accelerated tweaked program to get folks out of the PFS funk a little faster. Obviously I wouldn’t expect them to work in tandem for the overall balancing from a health perspective.

But I also am totally against the kitchen sink method of throwing everything on top of each other, so maybe simple and easy is what individuals need to stick to.

WE are trying accelerated programs. right now. And none of them are approved yet. As you can see yet. this is why this forum is private now. since we want to test protocols and see if they work first. and then open up.


I mean Cdnuts people go at it for a year and more. and very few succeed/ We want a high success rate, plus much faster.


So how will that accelerate TEI.

We are going to try to feed hormones mentioned in the first post. may be it will work faster.

PLus test and anavar route. WE are doing and trying accelerated programs.

but the things is even if you do some accelerated program. it could just put you in some fucked up body chemistry, which just gives you libido , but leaves you with 20 other problems. And then if you do TEI< they will have to break you apart again anyway.


The problem of hairloss and PFS and most problems, is the difference in content of minerals in BRAIN, and body.


That is why feeding random minerals and multivitamin can be even bad and make things, worse.


If brain has more copper, than needed. lets say, it would tell the body to bind estrogen, and you can be severely copper deficient in tissues.

as a simple example. TEI deals with brain liver and tissue compartments. it is not a replacement program. It forces those levels to become equal.


this is what hairloss is all about.


If you want to feed everything as a substitution you can feed electrolytes protocol. And hope that super high doses of Bs suggested will take care of brain free metal levels.


you see we dont even know if feeding these hormones will be good yet. What if brain is full of some minerals and specifically does not want these hormones.

It is very tricky. that is why it is still experimental until we see more results.

 

[Walker]

WE are trying accelerated programs. right now. And none of them are approved yet. As you can see yet. this is why this forum is private now. since we want to test protocols and see if they work first. and then open up.


I mean Cdnuts people go at it for a year and more. and very few succeed/ We want a high success rate, plus much faster.


So how will that accelerate TEI.

We are going to try to feed hormones mentioned in the first post. may be it will work faster.

PLus test and anavar route. WE are doing and trying accelerated programs.

but the things is even if you do some accelerated program. it could just put you in some fucked up body chemistry, which just gives you libido , but leaves you with 20 other problems. And then if you do TEI< they will have to break you apart again anyway.


The problem of hairloss and PFS and most problems, is the difference in content of minerals in BRAIN, and body.


That is why feeding random minerals and multivitamin can be even bad and make things, worse.


If brain has more copper, than needed. lets say, it would tell the body to bind estrogen, and you can be severely copper deficient in tissues.

as a simple example. TEI deals with brain liver and tissue compartments. it is not a replacement program. It forces those levels to become equal.


this is what hairloss is all about.


If you want to feed everything as a substitution you can feed electrolytes protocol. And hope that super high doses of Bs suggested will take care of brain free metal levels.


you see we dont even know if feeding these hormones will be good yet. What if brain is full of some minerals and specifically does not want these hormones.

It is very tricky. that is why it is still experimental until we see more results.

I get all that. I was referring to herbals and prohormones boosting from hormone side with a program like TEI. That’s what I meant by more “mixing” for a more specialized PFS-based protocol. Given that they are both currently “approved” from the view of this forum.

But you’re dead on - it’s very tricky.

 

[Helen]

@Walker I think you confuse what TEI is. they make you suffer. they give you some stuff that chelates, changes minerals balance in certain tissues.

Like if they see high copper in brain, they will chelate the hell out of copper and you will feel copper deficiency symptoms at first and suffer.
and then they will turn around and give you copper, if they see brain copper is fine. and that now giving copper, will be distributed evenly.

TEI is far from a multivitamin, It is very unbalanced program. With huge dosages over RDA of stuff. which do specific stuff.

How can you mix it with something. they specifically tested and created a program how with certain mineral manipulate certain things.


Program like Electrolytes protocol, that is different, that is basically natural protocol of EVERYTHING. but with much increased Bs so they can do the job of chelation faster


Hormones are the things that retain minerals into the cell.

Lets say when the body wants copper into the cell , it raises estrogen, and estrogen increases ceruloplasmin from the liver which carries copper into the cell.

If you give testosterone or DHT. they carry IRON into the cell.

Thus if iron is high in the cell, test does not work. And that is why test increases RBC. since it puts iron into cells.

And every hormones is like that.

So when people use some hormones, when gene expression is activated by some hormone, it tells the body to retain certain minerals.


For instance. menopausal women go bald . why ? since they have no estrogen.
Estrogen increases ceruloplasmin, and this forces copper and iron into the cell. So now you have copper, for SODS, and iron for Nitric oxide.


and most men, get bald from steroids, since they force iron into the cell which creates free radicals. without copper or zinc.

 

[Helen]

@Walker TEI is a precise program, designed for you. they give diff supplement to different people in diff combinations. Those supplements, do specific things. in one person they raise thyroid, in another person they lower thyroid. in third they kill adrenal gland, in forth, they support kidney function.

in another they will chelate iron. in forth, they will add iron


Hormone therapy is worthless in this case. since you will alter their program, and waste the money.



for just PFS, we can use the program which we will create shortly with hormones. I am already trying it out on 2 people with different combination of hormones from the first post in this thread.

We are not doing herbs, or any of that stuff, since we dont know what those herbs do.

Plus we are doing anavar and other routes. We are trying out these routes.


And in some way we get results in week, not years. like with random herbs.

TEI is a separate regulatory program, which does not need hormones. since you dont have to regulate body with hormones you can do the same with minerals.


Look at @Goose12 , he was on cdnuts for 6 months and doing it a lot more precise than Trump or most people. with all the supplements which cost him 4 grand for 3 months?. and prohormones.

Ask him the difference, with TEI. TEI balances you , your body chemistry, you cant do it with random stuff. Why would you want to fuck that up with Cdnuts protocol


If people want to do Cdnuts protocol, or anavars, or other hormone routes that we will outline. they should do them without TEI.

And may be go on TEI later on. But these hormone routes should be fast routes then, like 2-3 months max routes. Like with anavar some people get the results that they did not get on cdnuts for years.So we have to understand how that worked and for whom.

this is why we are stll playing with the hormonal routes, and i still dont approved then yet..

2 protocols which are approved are Cdnuts protocol, and TEI. people can chose and try both. But mixing them makes absolutely zero sense.

Cdnuts protocol is approved since it somewhat matches this theory, plus it has history, which is good.


After our trials with anavar, and with the new protocol which is outlined in this thread, estrogen, progesterone, DHT, pregnenolone. etc(
after we get results on it. or lack of results, then we will see what to do.

We are in the middle of the trials of hormonal routes. and faster routes, etc.

 

[sanka]

@Helen how we can balance with electrolytes protocol if we just take Mgcl, Kcl and Nacl in some cases. I mean a completr balance

 

[Helen]

@Helen how we can balance with electrolytes protocol if we just take Mgcl, Kcl and Nacl in some cases. I mean a completr balance

you never take just mg k and na on electrolytes protocol, what are you even talking about?

you take all amino acids, on electrolyte protocol, shilagit, B vitamins in crazy amounts. and etc

you are taking electrolytes protocol. you are not taking Mg K and Na.)) only plus as I told you follow what orion is doing. but you are taking crazy amounts of some of the electrolytes, could get gastritis from chloride

Electrolytes protocol is just a name. it is not about electrolytes only.

 

[Helen]

Folks, this thread was about a specific combination of certain hormones, which was found low in CSF in PFS people. And I came up with the theory , why they are low and what is going on.

It is not about feeding everything. And this protocol is totally different, since if we feed hormones what are low in CSF, testosterone will actually tank not rise.

 

[sanka]

Yes I understand that but how taking Bs and aminos can balance the other minerals, thats my question

 

[Helen]

Yes I understand that but how taking Bs and aminos can balance the other minerals, thats my question

please stop derailing this thread. there is electrolytes protocol thread for this. electrolyte protocol has minerals in it also. you need to read it and see what Orion takes. . Seriously , I dont know how many times I should repeat the same thing.

I took down electrolytes protocol so people dont bug me about it. Since I dont want to deal with people on one on one basis. I have no time for that.

you decided to follow it. so follow it. and look at what Orion is taking. or took. or read the protocol in tubzy's signature.

 

[Goose12]

Found a really interesting article about steroids, the blood brain barrier, and there effects in the brain. It's mostly out of my realm of understanding but one key thing is steroid hormones in the blood easily pass the bbb and are usually the same levels in the blood and brain. It also talks about interaction between hormone levels in the and receptors. Fits a lot with Helens theory.

Brain Meets Body: The Blood-Brain Barrier as an Endocrine Interface

Also mentions how hormones regulate minerals.

 

[Goose12]

This is a rat study

 

[vicecaz]

One could ask himself who is smarter; nature with herbs, such as them present in cdnuts protocol with a specific ratio of minerals and the bioavailability that comes with it, or human knowledge and his specific dosage through TEI following hair analysis (which as Helen said, is definitely a more individual and specific approach than the herbs) probably with an availability weaker than the herbs ( hypothesis, and that might be taken into account by TEI labs anyway ) .

I think these are 2 amazing approach to our issue, TEI giving our body reactions, good or bad, much faster than cdnuts protocol . I agree that taking herbs is more like a " loading on everything " and hope for the best kind of approach while TEI shock the body with stronger and more specific amount of minerals


Thing is, cdnuts approach is the protocol with the biggest ratio of success, as of today, however long it takes for one to recover. While TEI, granted as a much younger protocol with not enough time or trial, has only a few recovery/progress case that will no doubt grow in the future

I tend to disagree with the idea of using Cdnuts's baldness to discredit the protocol . Recovering one's mind, libido, emotions, and the rest of the side effects brought by fin, accutane or whatever drug, is a sign of a body working optimally, probably not perfectly, but optimally for sure
Nothing stops people recovered by cd's protocol to go on TEI to balance themselves either, that'd be great to see even

Cdnuts protocol isn't also just herbs, the lifestyle's part of it, meditation, cold shower, sun, etc. is an amazing tool, and should be advised to follow even for people on TEI, imo



I wish every balding men on earth could jump on TEI and see if It regrows, or at least halts/stops their hair loss. the theory behind it makes sense but that sounds unlikely in practice with the multiple potential cause of hair loss. Still, Could TEI recover every sides but the hair loss, that would be an amazing news and the best approach out there . As stated above, we'll see
Goose or Tony soprano cases are very promising


I agree with you not to take anything with TEI, it's either the loading everything approach ( electrolyte protocol or cdnuts ), or TEI with its specific ratio and combination of minerals meant to guide your body where it needs to be, following TEI's algorithm

 

[Helen]

One could ask himself who is smarter; nature with herbs, such as them present in cdnuts protocol with a specific ratio of minerals and the bioavailability that comes with it, or human knowledge and his specific dosage through TEI following hair analysis (which as Helen said, is definitely a more individual and specific approach than the herbs) probably with an availability weaker than the herbs ( hypothesis, and that might be taken into account by TEI labs anyway ) .

I think these are 2 amazing approach to our issue, TEI giving our body reactions, good or bad, much faster than cdnuts protocol . I agree that taking herbs is more like a " loading on everything " and hope for the best kind of approach while TEI shock the body with stronger and more specific amount of minerals


Thing is, cdnuts approach is the protocol with the biggest ratio of success, as of today, however long it takes for one to recover. While TEI, granted as a much younger protocol with not enough time or trial, has only a few recovery/progress case that will no doubt grow in the future

I tend to disagree with the idea of using Cdnuts's baldness to discredit the protocol . Recovering one's mind, libido, emotions, and the rest of the side effects brought by fin, accutane or whatever drug, is a sign of a body working optimally, probably not perfectly, but optimally for sure
Nothing stops people recovered by cd's protocol to go on TEI to balance themselves either, that'd be great to see even

Cdnuts protocol isn't also just herbs, the lifestyle's part of it, meditation, cold shower, sun, etc. is an amazing tool, and should be advised to follow even for people on TEI, imo



I wish every balding men on earth could jump on TEI and see if It regrows, or at least halts/stops their hair loss. the theory behind it makes sense but that sounds unlikely in practice with the multiple potential cause of hair loss. Still, Could TEI recover every sides but the hair loss, that would be an amazing news and the best approach out there . As stated above, we'll see
Goose or Tony soprano cases are very promising


I agree with you not to take anything with TEI, it's either the loading everything approach ( electrolyte protocol or cdnuts ), or TEI with its specific ratio and combination of minerals meant to guide your body where it needs to be, following TEI's algorithm

Cdnuts protocol or TEI or loading approaches have nothing to do with current theory outlined in this thread. Stop derailing the thread.


If this protocol works, it will be opposite of Cdnuts protocol. since this protocol LOWERS testosterone.

I have no idea why people even started to talk about it or TEI in this thread. It has nothing to do with neither.


those protocols are approved and people can do them, Cdnuts, electrolytes, TEI.


Here we are discussing studies and hormonal routes and NADPH route. Not some herbs, or TEI supplements.

this is a discussion, NOT a protocol. A protocol outlined here will be tried. and being tried now.

And it has nothing to do with any other approaches. and it is not approved yet.

 

[Ocguy]

One could ask himself who is smarter; nature with herbs, such as them present in cdnuts protocol with a specific ratio of minerals and the bioavailability that comes with it, or human knowledge and his specific dosage through TEI following hair analysis (which as Helen said, is definitely a more individual and specific approach than the herbs) probably with an availability weaker than the herbs ( hypothesis, and that might be taken into account by TEI labs anyway ) .

I think these are 2 amazing approach to our issue, TEI giving our body reactions, good or bad, much faster than cdnuts protocol . I agree that taking herbs is more like a " loading on everything " and hope for the best kind of approach while TEI shock the body with stronger and more specific amount of minerals


Thing is, cdnuts approach is the protocol with the biggest ratio of success, as of today, however long it takes for one to recover. While TEI, granted as a much younger protocol with not enough time or trial, has only a few recovery/progress case that will no doubt grow in the future

I tend to disagree with the idea of using Cdnuts's baldness to discredit the protocol . Recovering one's mind, libido, emotions, and the rest of the side effects brought by fin, accutane or whatever drug, is a sign of a body working optimally, probably not perfectly, but optimally for sure
Nothing stops people recovered by cd's protocol to go on TEI to balance themselves either, that'd be great to see even

Cdnuts protocol isn't also just herbs, the lifestyle's part of it, meditation, cold shower, sun, etc. is an amazing tool, and should be advised to follow even for people on TEI, imo



I wish every balding men on earth could jump on TEI and see if It regrows, or at least halts/stops their hair loss. the theory behind it makes sense but that sounds unlikely in practice with the multiple potential cause of hair loss. Still, Could TEI recover every sides but the hair loss, that would be an amazing news and the best approach out there . As stated above, we'll see
Goose or Tony soprano cases are very promising


I agree with you not to take anything with TEI, it's either the loading everything approach ( electrolyte protocol or cdnuts ), or TEI with its specific ratio and combination of minerals meant to guide your body where it needs to be, following TEI's algorithm

For what it's worth, after a year on mineral balancing and periodic hair tests in 2015, As I became more balanced I started losing hair as libido grew stronger.. I still had a way to go balancing wise, so hair loss might have reversed while maintaining libido had i kept up with it.
that's the goal this time around

totally agree with Helen in that we were already unbalanced prefin or we wouldn't have lost hair to begin with.

 

[Helen]

Cdnuts people , there is a Cdnuts corner. please discuss that protocol there. and stop derailing my thread. which has NOTHING To do with cdnuts protocol

I wanted to discuss the findings. and the possible hormonal routes. ( anavars, hormones,) but for some weird reason we are discussing herbs)) and then

some people discuss TEI on top of herbs. WTF?

There is A SPECIFIC combination of HORMONES discussed in this thread. Not some T boosters, Not TEI. not electrolytes protocol.


Those protocols are already discussed millions of times, and outlined, and approved. And people are doing them. What is there to discuss.

but everytime I post a theory, people start with should I switch to this now from Tei? or should I quit this or do that instead.

And now 2 pages of TEI vs Cdnuts . what the hell. Goose was on Cdnuts for 6 months. Did it do anything to him. NO.

No one is discrediting anything. If it helps people great. I am in no way against it.

but I dont want to discuss it in this thread, which has obviously nothing to do with this theory.

 

[vicecaz]

There's no Cdnuts people, or TEI people, there's people that want to make the best choice for their health
I replied to your post talking about herbs and TEI, feel free to move my post as well as yours wherever you think it fits best

For what it's worth, after a year on mineral balancing and periodic hair tests in 2015, As I became more balanced I started losing hair as libido grew stronger.. I still had a way to go balancing wise, so hair loss might have reversed while maintaining libido had i kept up with it.
that's the goal this time around

totally agree with Helen in that we were already unbalanced prefin or we wouldn't have lost hair to begin with.

agreed

 

[Ingeno]

For what it's worth, after a year on mineral balancing and periodic hair tests in 2015, As I became more balanced I started losing hair as libido grew stronger.. I still had a way to go balancing wise, so hair loss might have reversed while maintaining libido had i kept up with it.
that's the goal this time around

totally agree with Helen in that we were already unbalanced prefin or we wouldn't have lost hair to begin with.

My only gripe with TEI is that as of now, nobody got any regrowth with TEI so far and there are many people reporting increased shedding/hair loss, including myself. Yes TEI will fix your health, but there are so few cases where people fixed their mental issuess and libido while keeping their hair. In the end we value our hair so much, we ended up risking our health to keep our hair (Finasteride). What if you become balanced and keep losing your hair, then it means hair loss isn't a balancing issue, but indeed a genetic one.