Could this all be Prolactin related??

[DrivenToRecover]

Prolactin is 100% part of the story for me. Nofap is hugely beneficial.

Orgasm with or without a girl is always somewhat draining.

The absolute best I've felt after being sexual is when I intentionally didn't finish with a girl... while I was on cycle with Andro. Cloud 9.

 

[Helen]

Prolactin is 100% part of the story for me. Nofap is hugely beneficial.

Orgasm with or without a girl is always somewhat draining.

The absolute best I've felt after being sexual is when I intentionally didn't finish with a girl... while I was on cycle with Andro. Cloud 9.

why dont you guys test prolactin.. I had and have very low prolactin, and I had POIS with very low prolactin. And refractory period was also around a week, but prolactin was very low

We had 2 cases of POIS people, in some they had very low prolactin and in some on the high end. And reacted to different supplements

HIgh prolactin is usually a fast oxidizer. they react well to thyroid killing things. LIke carnitine, choline. etc

Me with low prolactin, I reacted terrible to carnitine, it cause me crazy pois , and choline was the same, severe depression and brain fog.

Some POIS people react to testosterone with complete elimination of all their symptoms, and some reacted to testoterone as 2-3 times worse symptoms. Although test levels were low in both cases.

this is why it is so hard to follow each other, since cases are different it seems.


POIS is total drainage after orgasm with the girl or not. in its worst, you just crash after orgasm hard with anxiety , inflammation etc.

A lot of people's symptoms on PFS forum are actually POIS. not PFS. the crashes from orgasms that last at around 7 to 14 days.

 

[DrivenToRecover]

why dont you guys test prolactin.. I had and have very low prolactin, and I had POIS with very low prolactin. And refractory period was also around a week, but prolactin was very low

We had 2 cases of POIS people, in some they had very low prolactin and in some on the high end. And reacted to different supplements

HIgh prolactin is usually a fast oxidizer. they react well to thyroid killing things. LIke carnitine, choline. etc

Me with low prolactin, I reacted terrible to carnitine, it cause me crazy pois , and choline was the same, severe depression and brain fog.

Some POIS people react to testosterone with complete elimination of all their symptoms, and some reacted to testoterone as 2-3 times worse symptoms. Although test levels were low in both cases.

this is why it is so hard to follow each other, since cases are different it seems.


POIS is total drainage after orgasm with the girl or not. in its worst, you just crash after orgasm hard with anxiety , inflammation etc.

A lot of people's symptoms on PFS forum are actually POIS. not PFS. the crashes from orgasms that last at around 7 to 14 days.

I got to a stage in my recovery where I didn't have any negative feeling post-nut, but then I touched an old broken finasteride pill, and re-crashed myself. That particular symptom has stuck around more stubbornly this time.

Interesting that you mention thyroid too. Soon after crashing my tsh tested as high as 32 at one point! But I do have Hashimotos as well that I hadn't started medicating then.

 

[Helen]

People get PFS and POIS kinds of states even after heavy overmasturbation for a while. More and more people come to POISCENTER.COM.

And those people never ever taken fin or SSRI, or any of that stuff, And they have PFS and POIS .

It is seems whatever is causing this, is causing this in a huge number of population, Not just post fin or post ssri.

It is really crazy if you think about it, how fast this population is growing. Some call it CFS, some call it POIS, some call it post PFS, some call it PSSD.

what all of them have in common thru the years of testing, is low reduced glutathione and high oxidized. I have tested may be close to a 1000 of all these folks

So it is something to do with B2 or b1 regulation, or may be phosphorus. and vitamin D3 regulation.

 

[DrivenToRecover]

People get PFS and POIS kinds of states even after heavy overmasturbation for a while. More and more people come to POISCENTER.COM.

And those people never ever taken fin or SSRI, or any of that stuff, And they have PFS and POIS .

It is seems whatever is causing this, is causing this in a huge number of population, Not just post fin or post ssri.

It is really crazy if you think about it, how fast this population is growing. Some call it CFS, some call it POIS, some call it post PFS, some call it PSSD.

what all of them have in common thru the years of testing, is low reduced glutathione and high oxidized. I have tested may be close to a 1000 of all these folks

So it is something to do with B2 or b1 regulation, or may be phosphorus. and vitamin D3 regulation.

I've heard this theory: part of the issue being solo masturbation causes huge dopamine spikes and high prolactin afterward...and that all of this is done in absence of any oxytocin from having a real partner present to modulate. Chronically it makes logical sense this could cause issues.

Would you lend credence to this idea?

 

[Helen]

I got to a stage in my recovery where I didn't have any negative feeling post-nut, but then I touched an old broken finasteride pill, and re-crashed myself. That particular symptom has stuck around more stubbornly this time.

Interesting that you mention thyroid too. Soon after crashing my tsh tested as high as 32 at one point! But I do have Hashimotos as well that I hadn't started medicating then.

Fin is a progestin. Progestin is something that increase potassium level in the body. I assume this is how it stops the hairloss.

Usually progesterone increases potassium level. and when potassium goes too high, progesterone turns into cortisol. And cortisol starts wasting potassium , when cortisol wastes enough potassium , cortisol falls, and progesterone rises. and they go like this back and forth

Progestin cant convert into cortisol, so when potassium rises too much, body tries to downregulate 1) progesterone receptor 2) thyroid levels

potassium makes thyroid sensitive in the cell. so the more potassuim you have in the cell the higher metabolism and less thyroid hormone you need.

so if you take progestin, like fin, this downregulates progesterone receptor and also downregulates thyroid, since potassium is 2 high.

Then you quit fin. Boom potassium crashes since there is no more progestin, and now you have downregulated progesterone and also downregulated thyroid. And boom zero metabolism.

 

[djohn051]

Prolactin is the only hormone I've had consistent issues in elevation with. I just started on Caber a week ago. Ask me in a couple weeks if I feel better.

 

[IHateFin]

So, watching my pattern over the last month. Libido will come raging back a week to 12 days after my wife and I have sex. When it is back, it is like being pre PFS. Problem is I am in such a rush to have sex to keep my lady happy. The time in between feels like a week long refractory period. Could it all be prolactin? If I took something to reduce the prolactin, could it speed up that recovery time? Or am I thinking about this all wrong?

It could be partially due to prolactin. If you want to take something for it to see I would try vitamin b6 inactivated. That shut is no joke for prolactin 50 to 200mg a day

 

[Grambo]

why dont you guys test prolactin.. I had and have very low prolactin, and I had POIS with very low prolactin. And refractory period was also around a week, but prolactin was very low

We had 2 cases of POIS people, in some they had very low prolactin and in some on the high end. And reacted to different supplements

HIgh prolactin is usually a fast oxidizer. they react well to thyroid killing things. LIke carnitine, choline. etc

Me with low prolactin, I reacted terrible to carnitine, it cause me crazy pois , and choline was the same, severe depression and brain fog.

Some POIS people react to testosterone with complete elimination of all their symptoms, and some reacted to testoterone as 2-3 times worse symptoms. Although test levels were low in both cases.

this is why it is so hard to follow each other, since cases are different it seems.


POIS is total drainage after orgasm with the girl or not. in its worst, you just crash after orgasm hard with anxiety , inflammation etc.

A lot of people's symptoms on PFS forum are actually POIS. not PFS. the crashes from orgasms that last at around 7 to 14 days.

I also have low prolactin and POIS. 3.2 ng/ml. Range 2.0-18. What did you find to work for you? Interesting how too low and too high can have such similar symptoms.

 

[r4ndom]

Fin is a progestin. Progestin is something that increase potassium level in the body. I assume this is how it stops the hairloss.

Usually progesterone increases potassium level. and when potassium goes too high, progesterone turns into cortisol. And cortisol starts wasting potassium , when cortisol wastes enough potassium , cortisol falls, and progesterone rises. and they go like this back and forth

Progestin cant convert into cortisol, so when potassium rises too much, body tries to downregulate 1) progesterone receptor 2) thyroid levels

potassium makes thyroid sensitive in the cell. so the more potassuim you have in the cell the higher metabolism and less thyroid hormone you need.

so if you take progestin, like fin, this downregulates progesterone receptor and also downregulates thyroid, since potassium is 2 high.

Then you quit fin. Boom potassium crashes since there is no more progestin, and now you have downregulated progesterone and also downregulated thyroid. And boom zero metabolism.

yes makes sense, so how do you handle the potassium issue? i think PFS in general is just low potassium because it was all wasted while you are on it. it seems like this is PFS entirely, just low potassium. when you get off it though, the progestin should be gone, but the metabolism is just too low from being on finasteride in the first place. so the pregnenlone is really low and the metabolism makes digestion messed up. stress cannot be handled at all, i'm assuming from low B vitamins and no glycogen. what's the missing key you think? just long term low stress and rebuiding missing minerals?

 

[Ocguy]

why dont you guys test prolactin.. I had and have very low prolactin, and I had POIS with very low prolactin. And refractory period was also around a week, but prolactin was very low

We had 2 cases of POIS people, in some they had very low prolactin and in some on the high end. And reacted to different supplements

HIgh prolactin is usually a fast oxidizer. they react well to thyroid killing things. LIke carnitine, choline. etc

Me with low prolactin, I reacted terrible to carnitine, it cause me crazy pois , and choline was the same, severe depression and brain fog.

Some POIS people react to testosterone with complete elimination of all their symptoms, and some reacted to testoterone as 2-3 times worse symptoms. Although test levels were low in both cases.

this is why it is so hard to follow each other, since cases are different it seems.


POIS is total drainage after orgasm with the girl or not. in its worst, you just crash after orgasm hard with anxiety , inflammation etc.

A lot of people's symptoms on PFS forum are actually POIS. not PFS. the crashes from orgasms that last at around 7 to 14 days.

Yes, I don't think it's prolactin.. I tested and it was below mid range..

This feels like sexual exhaustion but it's definitely caused by fin or avodart.

In 2009 I was in pois or PFS state but it was slight.. had no idea just thought I was bored with porn.. anyway I quit porn and fapping.. it took 4 months , heavy gym, eating perfect libido came raging back.

there is a sexual energy buildup the longer you refrain.. pre fin status lasted a year. But of course I started fapping 3x a day and it faded. But still wasn't fully healed during abstinence mind you, the skin on my face was very thin and suffered lots of fat loss. .(thought it was from a laser treatment) but the sexual sides were gone and energy was high

As time has gone on my dicipline to not fap when feeling horny has put me deeper in the hole.

I think for some of us if we could seriously stop orgasming for at least a year or 1 per month max, we could come out of this.. for me its what always leads to the downward cycle.

It would also be interesting to see if pois guys have high sodium / potassium which seems to be a constant battle.. I have a hair test in 2015 after I pulled a year of very limited fap and sodium potassium was near range, libido was 35 to 40 percent.. lost the dicipline and went downhill again with long weekly 10 day refractory periods.. sodium potassium back high..

What really hurt me was testosterone.. I didn't listen to my instincts and went with the pellets.. well they shoot that shit in your ass and it takes 6 months to fully dissolve..your stuck with it.

back then refractory was 3 days pre pellets.. after pellets libido pumped up and I started fapping 1 per day after 45 days was totally wiped out and the T started working against me.. BP shot up, straining to urinate.. etc I was in the hardest PFS state ever.. took a year of very limited fap (1 per month) just to get back to my shitty baseline pre pellets

One thing I've learned, is even taking herbs or some weird thing u find that gives you libido (like sardines or whatever ) don't test it, don't start thinking yourr healed and over do the orgasms.
I think that's why some of us just keep spinning our wheels. And then u reach a point where nothing you take even sparks the libido anymore, you have crashed even further..it's taken a lot of crashes to finally come out of denial that orgasms are the biggest problems many of us face as the main hurdle to heal..just my thoughts

 

[bruschi11]

I got to a stage in my recovery where I didn't have any negative feeling post-nut, but then I touched an old broken finasteride pill, and re-crashed myself. That particular symptom has stuck around more stubbornly this time.

Interesting that you mention thyroid too. Soon after crashing my tsh tested as high as 32 at one point! But I do have Hashimotos as well that I hadn't started medicating then.

U just touched it? Or swallowed it?

Man didn’t know pfs could come back just from contact.

 

[r4ndom]

Yes, I don't think it's prolactin.. I tested and it was below mid range..

This feels like sexual exhaustion but it's definitely caused by fin or avodart.

In 2009 I was in pois or PFS state but it was slight.. had no idea just thought I was bored with porn.. anyway I quit porn and fapping.. it took 4 months , heavy gym, eating perfect libido came raging back.

there is a sexual energy buildup the longer you refrain.. pre fin status lasted a year. But of course I started fapping 3x a day and it faded. But still wasn't fully healed during abstinence mind you, the skin on my face was very thin and suffered lots of fat loss. .(thought it was from a laser treatment) but the sexual sides were gone and energy was high

As time has gone on my dicipline to not fap when feeling horny has put me deeper in the hole.

I think for some of us if we could seriously stop orgasming for at least a year or 1 per month max, we could come out of this.. for me its what always leads to the downward cycle.

It would also be interesting to see if pois guys have high sodium / potassium which seems to be a constant battle.. I have a hair test in 2015 after I pulled a year of very limited fap and sodium potassium was near range, libido was 35 to 40 percent.. lost the dicipline and went downhill again with long weekly 10 day refractory periods.. sodium potassium back high..

What really hurt me was testosterone.. I didn't listen to my instincts and went with the pellets.. well they shoot that shit in your ass and it takes 6 months to fully dissolve..your stuck with it.

back then refractory was 3 days pre pellets.. after pellets libido pumped up and I started fapping 1 per day after 45 days was totally wiped out and the T started working against me.. BP shot up, straining to urinate.. etc I was in the hardest PFS state ever.. took a year of very limited fap (1 per month) just to get back to my shitty baseline pre pellets

One thing I've learned, is even taking herbs or some weird thing u find that gives you libido (like sardines or whatever ) don't test it, don't start thinking yourr healed and over do the orgasms.
I think that's why some of us just keep spinning our wheels. And then u reach a point where nothing you take even sparks the libido anymore, you have crashed even further..it's taken a lot of crashes to finally come out denial that orgasms are the biggest problems many of us face as the main hurdle to heal..just my thoughts

u fapped 3x a day for a year? or u just started after a year, then u lost it all?

 

[Ocguy]

u fapped 3x a day for a year? or u just started after a year, then u lost it all?

I started fin in 1998, didn't have any sides that I attributed to the drug, looking back I realize it messed up my digestion and occasional watery semen but libido was fine.. fapped every few days but marathon sessions when I did + normal sex life.. in 2007 I switched to avodart.. no girlfriend but still fapped every 3rd day (about 2 to 3 o's)

In june 2008 I started noticing a somewhat decrease in libido, already lost a ton of fat in my cheeks and skin got thin like paper

I quit avodart , quit porn. Quit fap in June 2008.. by October of 2008. I became Uber horny, like a dog in heat.. massive rock hard erections and sex on the brain constantly.. so yea I started fapping again to porn.. 1 morning, 1 afternoon, 1 at night.. if I was out fucking women (which was often ) I still busted 2 to porn and 1 at night from sex.. that lasted up thru 2010..

by 2011 I started feeling strange, not quite myself and drive took about 50 percent nosedive.. so didn't fap as often.. but then all the health problems began.. detox pathways got blocked, mold toxicity, lyme, mycoplasma, rickettsia, Bartonella etc.. libido kept getting worse every time I fapped which at that point was once per week.
Now I'm lyme free, but have all the sexual sides.. it was the switch from fin to avodart I believe that really damaged things cuz while on it that's when I knew something was wrong..

but the full crash took about a year to really hit.. aside from fapping, I was an animal in the gym and ate 90 % clean, lots of raw foods, occasional meats.. and lots of herbs, adaptogens, green powders etc.. thats why i think it took me a little longer than most to crash after stopping.. but looking back thru the years, it's the orgasms that did the most damage in spite of all the good things.

 

[r4ndom]

I started fin in 1998, didn't have any sides that I attributed to the drug, looking back I realize it messed up my digestion and occasional watery semen but libido was fine.. fapped every few days but marathon sessions when I did + normal sex life.. in 2007 I switched to avodart.. no girlfriend but still fapped every 3rd day (about 2 to 3 o's)

In june 2008 I started noticing a somewhat decrease in libido, already lost a ton of fat in my cheeks and skin got thin like paper

I quit avodart , quit porn. Quit fap in June 2008.. by October of 2008. I became Uber horny, like a dog in heat.. massive rock hard erections and sex on the brain constantly.. so yea I started fapping again to porn.. 1 morning, 1 afternoon, 1 at night.. if I was out fucking women (which was often ) I still busted 2 to porn and 1 at night from sex.. that lasted up thru 2010..

by 2011 I started feeling strange, not quite myself and drive took about 50 percent nosedive.. so didn't fap as often.. but then all the health problems began.. detox pathways got blocked, mold toxicity, lyme, mycoplasma, rickettsia, Bartonella etc.. libido kept getting worse every time I fapped which at that point was once per week.
Now I'm lyme free, but have all the sexual sides.. it was the switch from fin to avodart I believe that really damaged things cuz while on it that's when I knew something was wrong..

but the full crash took about a year to really hit.. aside from fapping, I was an animal in the gym and ate 90 % clean, lots of raw foods, occasional meats.. and lots of herbs, adaptogens, green powders etc.. thats why i think it took me a little longer than most to crash after stopping.. but looking back thru the years, it's the orgasms that did the most damage in spite of all the good things.

thats crazy man. i notice a lot of swings in myself too. sometimes i'll feel overly hot, like my metabolism is in overload, then it feels like it crashes, and i go back to feeling like shit. i can see how if you had everything straight, that extreme metabolism would really push your sexuality into overdrive.

 

[Ocguy]

thats crazy man. i notice a lot of swings in myself too. sometimes i'll feel overly hot, like my metabolism is in overload, then it feels like it crashes, and i go back to feeling like shit. i can see how if you had everything straight, that extreme metabolism would really push your sexuality into overdrive.

Yea, I know.. total yo yo.

got to be a warrior with this situation.

 

[DrivenToRecover]

U just touched it? Or swallowed it?

Man didn’t know pfs could come back just from contact.

I only touched it and I immediately washed my hands too.

It was a broken pill. There's warnings on the stuff that pregnant women that touch it will get birth defects. Crazy how potent the stuff is.

I'm also not one of these folks that gets "crashed" from doing this and that. Just the initial crash and from touching the pill.

 

[bruschi11]

OMG wow!!!!!!

 

[RebelWithACause]

Very interesting.

I got wet dream 3 days ago and boom I feel back to a lot of PFS signs: bad erections/no erections, low libido, anger, lower confidence. Also STOMACH is fucked up. Bloated more.

Although it is not as bad as when I first quit finasteride (PFS side effects like extreme anxiety, low metabolism, etc.)

Before I ever took finasteride I had POIS type symptoms. It was worse then it is now. I would have extreme brainfog, high anxiety, depression and anti-social after an orgasm. Especially masturbation. But also wet dreams when I started NoFap.

I ate diet low in zinc. It would take a week to feel normal and confident again. I would also be much weaker in the gym in that period.

When I started supplementing with zinc right after masturbation I would be back to normal in 2-3 days instead of 5-7 days. Now I just eat red meat. It seems to help. Although supplementing zinc was more effective. But now I do not do it since I have overdone it in the past which also sucks dick.

This is why I have been doing NoFap since forever. It helps a lot. It might not fix the underlying issue but as long as I do not have an orgasm I feel good and some days even pre-finasteride. I had a few really good days last week where I was like "I am healed!". Like highest baseline I have reached. And then I got the wet dream and it seemed to put me back a bit.

With a girl I still get higher anxiety after orgasm but it is not as bad. Especially when I fuck the girl raw which I do with most girls. It seems to help chemically.

Also: When I eat high copper food like liver I feel shit day after I ate it. But then next few days I feel better. Higher libido, sometimes prefinasteride.

 

[hairsuit]

Yeah, I’m at a catch 22. I do nofap, but every time I am able to perform again, I want to satisfy my wife. So it’s not like I can take months off and no fap. There are husbandly duties. (Good God how pathetic to even say that. It’s usually the women who are just trying to keep their man happy. WTF has this shit done to us.....)