TubZy Log (cured)

[gaivs]

I was reading your threads. You have higher testosterone and DHT correct? How did your Ella trial end up?

Jack, yes high testosterone, DHT, progesterone and T3/T4. And normal-low estrogen. I still don't know what case I'm in that theory of two cases )

I did 5 days of around 2.5mg of Ella. It was also very good while on it, but it doesn't stick unhappily. It improved my libido while on it, but not so much as oxandrolone though.

 

[Area-1255]

This is from what we have seen so far:

high DHT people from what I have seen are slow oxidizers. they feel cured on cortisol.supps. they are opposite of anavar people. ( who feel cured on anavar like tubzy, ihatefin.)) . Belikewater , talkingant , those guys did not have libido on anavar. Probably because they are high DHT people.

May be these groups do better on snap backs after they quit anvar. Although talkingant did not report any improvements after he quit .


Slow oxidizers( high DHT people ) run on adrenaline, and thus lose sodium, thus DHT is high. since these people have no aldosterone action. and DHT increases aldosterone.

May be these people would react to vitamin b1 plus huge sodium load.( we are trying it out now)


Cortisol can also cure these people ,but the dosages has to be found . Since if you take too much cortisol you just go from slow oxidizers problems into fast oxidizers problems.

people need to find such a dose of cortisol, very very low and slowly raise it until they feel totally cured,

then stay on this dosage for 2 months and then quit. And body will learn how to live on this amount of cortisol

this is why there were cases on propecia forum when person cured himself with dexamethasone.( you might read about it)


Unfornunately progesterone wastes more sodium while increasing cortisol. this is why it does not hold.

When sodium is retained. body will lower DHT , since DHT increases aldosterone.


When sodium goes up , this will decrease adrenaline need and conversions of dopamine into noradrenaline and adrenaline will go down. Thus prolactin will automatically fall.

And since adrenaline will go down, fatty acids in blood will go down, so the body will have to convert progesterone into cortisol to get sugar into blood, since fatty acids are down now.


As of now people with high DHT simply have too much adrenaline , and thus too many fatty acids in blood. And this stops progesterone into cortisol conversions.

since cortisol is simply not needed. The body feeds on fat.

Another possible cure for these people will be 3 grams of niacin a day. this will stop adrenaline production.




I am trying this with 2 people now. IF this works I will write it all out.

Also High Sodium/Salt will decrease Serotonin, which will then *also* Lower Prolactin.
--> Effect of dietary salt restriction on urinary serotonin and 5-hydroxyindoleacetic acid excretion in man. - PubMed - NCBI

Effect of dietary salt restriction on urinary serotonin and 5-hydroxyindoleacetic acid excretion in Man.
Randomized controlled trial
Sharma AM, et al. J Hypertens. 1993.
Show full citation
Abstract
OBJECTIVE: To determine the effect of dietary salt restriction on urinary excretion of serotonin and its principal metabolite 5-hydroxyindoleacetic acid (5-HIAA) in man.
DESIGN: We studied 16 healthy male volunteers (age range 20-28 years) who ate a standard diet containing 20 mmol/day NaCl, to which either 220 mmol/day NaCl or placebo was added as a supplement for 1 week each, according to a randomized, single-blind crossover design.
METHODS: Urinary excretion of serotonin, 5-HIAA, noradrenaline and vanillylmandelic acid (VMA) were measured during the low- and high-salt periods using reverse-phase high-performance liquid chromatography.
RESULTS: During the low-salt diet, 24-h urinary excretion of serotonin increased by 42%, accompanied by a 52% rise in the excretion of 5-HIAA. Salt restriction also increased noradrenaline excretion by 77% and VMA excretion by 40%. Regression analysis revealed a strong positive relationship between the excretion of serotonin and of noradrenaline (r = 0.84, P < 0.001) and between that of 5-HIAA and of VMA (r = 0.74, P < 0.001).
CONCLUSIONS: Salt restriction stimulates the serotonergic system in man. Stimulation of this system, in conjunction with the sympathetic nervous system, may contribute to renal sodium conservation during dietary salt restriction in man.
PMID
7510737 [Indexed for MEDLINE]

 

[gaivs]

that sounds very similar to my experience expect I never had a drop in anything, things just got better as time went on near the time you said as well (day 10-14). However, I did get some headaches and mild insomnia but that is prob from the adrenaline, it didn't really bother me. Do you have blood test pre var of your hormones and stuff?

Boris not immediately pre, but I have made two tests before and they say same thing I have high androgens and progesterone. I didn't test electrolytes though. But I will do another test soon with everything.

 

[Helen]

Also High Sodium/Salt will decrease Serotonin, which will then *also* Lower Prolactin.
--> Effect of dietary salt restriction on urinary serotonin and 5-hydroxyindoleacetic acid excretion in man. - PubMed - NCBI

Effect of dietary salt restriction on urinary serotonin and 5-hydroxyindoleacetic acid excretion in Man.
Randomized controlled trial
Sharma AM, et al. J Hypertens. 1993.
Show full citation
Abstract
OBJECTIVE: To determine the effect of dietary salt restriction on urinary excretion of serotonin and its principal metabolite 5-hydroxyindoleacetic acid (5-HIAA) in man.
DESIGN: We studied 16 healthy male volunteers (age range 20-28 years) who ate a standard diet containing 20 mmol/day NaCl, to which either 220 mmol/day NaCl or placebo was added as a supplement for 1 week each, according to a randomized, single-blind crossover design.
METHODS: Urinary excretion of serotonin, 5-HIAA, noradrenaline and vanillylmandelic acid (VMA) were measured during the low- and high-salt periods using reverse-phase high-performance liquid chromatography.
RESULTS: During the low-salt diet, 24-h urinary excretion of serotonin increased by 42%, accompanied by a 52% rise in the excretion of 5-HIAA. Salt restriction also increased noradrenaline excretion by 77% and VMA excretion by 40%. Regression analysis revealed a strong positive relationship between the excretion of serotonin and of noradrenaline (r = 0.84, P < 0.001) and between that of 5-HIAA and of VMA (r = 0.74, P < 0.001).
CONCLUSIONS: Salt restriction stimulates the serotonergic system in man. Stimulation of this system, in conjunction with the sympathetic nervous system, may contribute to renal sodium conservation during dietary salt restriction in man.
PMID
7510737 [Indexed for MEDLINE]

Nope. Sodium transports serotonin into the cell, that is why it lowers serotonin in the urine)) Sert needs sodium to attach serotonin and chloride to enter the cell,

this is why SSRI causes hyponatremia. Since SSRI raises serotonin in the cell, and this lowers delivery of serotonin into the cell, thus SODIUM is flushed out

Sodium lowers prolactin since it decreases need for adrenaline.

 

[Troy]

I wrote many times what causes this , to slow down methylation NIACIN


Body is producing more adrenaline( methylation ) in slow oxidizer

Only in your case you have high cortisol.

I should mention my sleeping hours are messed up. I sleep late and get up late. I got the test done early afternoon. Maybe I am high for that time period but because of my body clock it might not actually be that high as it would be more like a mid morning test.

 

[gaivs]

Jack. how can he have a snap back ,if he felt good on var. Snap back is when you lose libido on something and then gain it.

In Boris's case he had a lot more libido on var. And then off var it leveled back down.

In belikewater's case , he had low libido on var and then libido came back to what it was prevar, but he slightly noticed better depression.



You need to cycle this alone to know if var helps you or not. Since you always were helped with progesterone and taking progesterone increases cortisol in you, so when cortisol increased you feel more dht. that is what progesterone does.


We talked to Boris, and I and him we felt terrible on cortisol supplements. but people like belikewater felt totally cured on cortisol supplements

this is why boris felt great on var since var blocked his cortisol while on var. And belikewater felt like shit on var, since he does good on cortisol

Helen do you think it is a good idea to continue? I still have some pills.

 

[Helen]

I should mention my sleeping hours are messed up. I sleep late and get up late. I got the test done early afternoon. Maybe I am high for that time period but because of my body clock it might not actually be that high as it would be more like a mid morning test.

just wait for B tests. And then we will see. your are so balanced now on HT.

 

[Helen]

Helen do you think it is a good idea to continue? I still have some pills.

If you feel ok to continue , continue.

 

[Troy]

just wait for B tests. And then we will see. your are so balanced now on HT.

I'm balanced on blood tests too. Sodium, magnesium and calcium are all almost dead in the middle of the range. Potassium is pretty good but maybe could go a touch higher.

Also could my balance be artificial because of the stuff I've taken? e.g. I take propecia and sodium should go up and potassium down. Then i take 5 ht and sodium comes down. Could it be an artifical balance?

 

[Helen]

I'm balanced on blood tests too. Sodium, magnesium and calcium are all almost dead in the middle of the range. Potassium is pretty good but maybe could go a touch higher.

Also could my balance be artificial because of the stuff I've taken? e.g. I take propecia and sodium should go up and potassium down. Then i take 5 ht and sodium comes down. Could it be an artifical balance?

you can check your PTH. what if calcium is coming from the bone.

 

[Troy]

you can check your PTH. what if calcium is coming from the bone.

What is PTH?

 

[Helen]

What is PTH?

contact me tomorrow, we will think more about this, Only not in this thread.

 

[Troy]

contact me tomorrow, we will think more about this, Only not in this thread.

No problems, will do

 

[TubZy]

Jack. how can he have a snap back ,if he felt good on var. Snap back is when you lose libido on something and then gain it.

In Boris's case he had a lot more libido on var. And then off var it leveled back down.

In belikewater's case , he had low libido on var and then libido came back to what it was prevar, but he slightly noticed better depression.



You need to cycle this alone to know if var helps you or not. Since you always were helped with progesterone and taking progesterone increases cortisol in you, so when cortisol increased you feel more dht. that is what progesterone does.


We talked to Boris, and I and him we felt terrible on cortisol supplements. but people like belikewater felt totally cured on cortisol supplements

this is why boris felt great on var since var blocked his cortisol while on var. And belikewater felt like shit on var, since he does good on cortisol

belikewater wrote today that he feels less stressed on var tho even tho he has lower libido. Which is the same effect I get. So how could he feel better when cort is blocked too you think?

 

[TubZy]

Jack, yes high testosterone, DHT, progesterone and T3/T4. And normal-low estrogen. I still don't know what case I'm in that theory of two cases )

I did 5 days of around 2.5mg of Ella. It was also very good while on it, but it doesn't stick unhappily. It improved my libido while on it, but not so much as oxandrolone though.

I get the same relaxed type feeling you are talking about on var. It likes 10 minutes after I take it, zero stress and could relax or fall asleep if I wanted to. It is from blocking cortisol. You cortisol sensitivity is most likely messed up like mine. Var blocks cort and puts us back on adrenaline

 

[brix]

I get the same relaxed type feeling you are talking about on var. It likes 10 minutes after I take it, zero stress and could relax or fall asleep if I wanted to. It is from blocking cortisol. You cortisol sensitivity is most likely messed up like mine. Var blocks cort and puts us back on adrenaline

Is cortisol more stimulating than adrenaline? Always figured it was opposite.

 

[TubZy]

Is cortisol more stimulating than adrenaline? Always figured it was opposite.

the body runs on both, if your cortisol is not working right you feel like crap and handles stress poorly, its is like a balancing act. Anavar completely blocks cortisol so body has no choice but to run on adrenaline, which I run fine on adrenaline, var basically feels like keto without the libido drop that keto gave me. Its like the same feeling as fasting if that makes sense, I felt more stimulated on var but not in a bad way hence why I said sometimes I get mild insomnia, music gets me fired up more, mild euphoria at random times, high confidence etc. basically all the signs of adrenaline. But I slept deeper and longer while on var despite the mild insomnia sometimes.

Pre var baseline I wake up feeling low energy (since cort is suppose to spike in the morning, but my cort is insensitive so it doesn't work properly). @Helen had low morning energy to when he crashed and he feel like shit when he takes cortisol as well like me

 

[Helen]

belikewater wrote today that he feels less stressed on var tho even tho he has lower libido. Which is the same effect I get. So how could he feel better when cort is blocked too you think?

Love , how people just see what they want to see.

Here is the quote from belikewater " Cant manage stress that well if I take Anavar, seem to have less stress and less PTSD after 3-4 after leaving Anavar, better focus also, but that could be Inositol."


You need to be more unbiased about anavar. If you were not taking B1 , I think you would be suffering now after anavar. Since anavar would make your cortisol even more sensitive. and taking B1 right now, basically kills sensitivity of cortisol. Since it constantly spikes it.

So may be you and I , really need cortisol. and belikewater needs more and more anavar cycles. to finally recover.

Who knows.

More trials are needed for people who get a snapback from quitting anavar

 

[TubZy]

Love , how people just see what they want to see.

Here is the quote from belikewater " Cant manage stress that well if I take Anavar, seem to have less stress and less PTSD after 3-4 after leaving Anavar, better focus also, but that could be Inositol."


You need to be more unbiased about anavar. If you were not taking B1 , I think you would be suffering now after anavar. Since anavar would make your cortisol even more sensitive. and taking B1 right now, basically kills sensitivity of cortisol. Since it constantly spikes it.

So may be you and I , really need cortisol. and belikewater needs more and more anavar cycles. to finally recover.

Who knows.

More trials are needed for people who get a snapback from quitting anavar

Not belikewater meant to say @gaivs

And why you using belikwater as a example in your earlier post, he is not clean trial either he is taking insoitol (ihatefin took inositol earlier in his log and felt good on it as well)

 

[Helen]

Not belikewater meant to say @gaivs

And why you using belikwater as a example, he is not clean he is taking insoitol

Boris you need to have sex with Natasha ASAP. Belikewater did not take inositol before. All I am saying that he feel bad on anavar.

Gaivs also had zero libido for a week. And now may be just got suppressed.