Shadow's living nightmare (PSSD Log)

[Shadow]

Im a 28yo male from Brazil, was put on SSRI(paroxetine) when I was 17 because of anxiety, I came in and off a couple of times without many problems aside for a week with brazin-zaps. The only side effect that I experienced was anorgasmia. At the 23 a switched from paroxetine to Escitalopram + Bupropion combo, for 3 years I had no problems, I dropped Bupropion and was only on Escitalopram.

Known problems:
1 - Rhinitis since childhood
2 - Migraine since childhood
3 - Hairloss
4 - Sedentarism
5 - Awlful diet

Then, some things started to happen on the following order:
1 - High blood pressure(was put on Losartan)
2 - Salivating a lot while asleep
3 - Urticaria/hives(histamine problems?)
5 - I started to forgetting the words
6 - Erectyle dysfunction.

I stopped Escitalopram and more shit started ti happen:
1 - Headaches
2 - Muscle pain and stiffness(legs mainly)
3 - Brain zaps
4 - Anxiety/panic
5 - An obnoxious feeling on a nerve on the right side of my genitals and pelvis(like I could feel the nerve being squeezed)
6 - suicidal

The doctor instisted that I reinstate escitalopram + bupropion and unfortunately I did. During this time:
1 - Tinnitus/Hyperacusis
2 - Pressure and weird feeling in ears and jaw
3 - A sensation on some nerves like they were itching, specially ring and little finger of hands and feet.
4 - Restless leg syndrom symptoms on my left leg
5 - I had a week of TOTAL recovery from sexual problems.
6 - Recovery started to fade, and genital numbness started.

I decided to taper the drugs, first was Bupropion(cold turkey), them Escitalopram, during this:
1 - The itchy nerves sensation became stronger
2 - Genital numbness was more present
3 - Numb spots on my body(mainly hands ans feet)
4 - Sexual dysfunction
5 - My WHOLE body lost sensitivity(hands and feet are the worst)

MY SYMPTOMS NOW
- Urticaria/hives
- Tinnitus
- Hypearcusis(improved just a little)
- Restless leg syndrome(improved)
- Obnoxious genital nerve problem(improved)
- Loss of whole body sensitivity
- Paresthesia
- PSSD(ED problems, no build up feeling, premature ejaculation, weak orgasms)
- Breathing problems
- Occasional back pain
- Anhedonia
- Anxiety feeling
- Sleep distrurbances
I left university and work, Im not functional right now.

 

[Canari]

I do not feel functional either man, but we are still alive and functional enough to be typing ! :mrgreen: lol I just prefer to joke because it is the only thing that is really human!

I have started to look for histamine too, and it seems linked to lack of sensitivity, and even lack of feeling pain.

Haven't you started a log so that you can go more into your intents for getting better and put your labs past present and future?

 

[Shadow]

Im just waiting for my appointment with the Dr, so I can request a ton of tests!

 

[Canari]

Since internet nformations, Drs have to deal with clients who request their tests themselves! That's good to feel a bit more in control...

 

[MNK99]

Just reading this... Sounds like me back then. It's great you can document your issues.
Are you doing a bit better now? When you say not functional, do you mean because anxiety is out of control or bc of all the damn issues the meds caused? @Shadow I'm sorry that is going on man.

 

[Shadow]

Just reading this... Sounds like me back then. It's great you can document your issues.
Are you doing a bit better now? When you say not functional, do you mean because anxiety is out of control or bc of all the damn issues the meds caused? @Shadow I'm sorry that is going on man.

Because of the damn issues. My nerves are not right... its so strange.

They feel like they are "raw", at some places I can feel them, its like an itch.

 

[Crushed]

Shadow,

I was taking Citalopram and I experienced a lot of the same symptoms upon withdrawal, I was 29 at the time. I asked my doctor for an appointment where I explained was was happening to me. When the nurse took my blood pressure (I think this was about two weeks after stopping the drug) she remarked that my blood pressure was very high! This was the first high blood pressure reading I had ever had in my life. I also experienced the numb hands and feet, as well as a reduction in sensitivity over my whole body. Two years later my genital area is still numb but some things have improved naturally.

Other things I experienced after withdrawal:

Night sweats
hot flashes
sore nipples
tingling/itchy scalp
pains in my penis/testicles
pins/needles sensation in my scrotum
painful erections/soft glans
absence of emotions
insomnia
extreme fatigue.
absence of libido


It was terrible! I understand how you feel and we are here fighting this with you, even if we are just strangers on the internet.

Thing that have naturally improved two years later:

insomnia
numb hands and feet
libido/sensitivity (maybe 1/3 of normal)
fatigue has lessened

I am able to continue a fairly normal life now from an outsider perspective. My internal life and quality of life are still very reduced and sometimes I still suffer terribly, but things are a lot better that the first few months. I withdrew from everything, including work and became suicidal. I'm telling you this all just to say things can get better to the point that it's livable on it's own. We are getting close to figuring this out it seems!

 

[Shadow]

Thank you guys! I really dont know how Im still strong and fighting this situation.

 

[Area-1255]

Hi Shadow, surprised I missed this thread.
So at first glance, it seems the "obnoxious nerve" issue may be some sort of inflammatory reaction around the nerve. Get your Doctor to perform an EMG (electromyogram).
Additionally, the initial allergy issue and other problems you are experiencing might be a sign of too much histamine.
Now, traditionally, we think that high histamine = high libido. But my belief is that if serotonin and / or inflammation is excessive, that effect will be less apparent.
Which means (knowing that SSRI's stimulate/rely on histamine) that you can have all the inflammation and neurotoxicity associated with elevated Histamine and have minimal symptoms.
My theory is that the desensitization of serotonergic autoreceptors (particularly 1A/1B) leads to enhanced systemic serotonin release. PSSDforum has that "theory" too, except they leave out the importance of 5-HT1B which has been in virtually EVERY STUDY relating to behavior in so many paradigms.
5-HT1B is actually MORE behaviorally and thus cognitively relevant.

I would see if you can get a blood test for the following.

• C-Reactive Protein
• TNF (Tumor-Necrosis-Factor-A)
• Complement C3 & C4.

We want to make sure there is no autoimmune disorder going on here...it sounds like its a tiny possibility, but really we just want to rule it out!

In addition, how many times have you checked PLASMA (not urine) sex hormones?
If several, when did you take the blood test (Morning,Afternoon,Evening etc).

Those and THYROID FUNCTION AKA A "Comprehensive Metabolic Panel" would be a good idea.
Plasma levels and hair levels of minerals are also a good idea, as Zinc:Copper imbalances are common in PSSD.

If you've ONLY tried Inositol so far, then you are missing out.
So at least start with good basic nutritional enhancement.

• Multi-Vitamin.
• Trace Mineral Research Boron.
• Vanadium.
• Tocotrienols.
• Creatine.

Those would be a good place to start, I'm willing to bet that stack would do something based on what you are saying.
It may not be a good idea to try any other "sensitizers" like Turmeric/Curcumin UNTIL you know your DHT level etc.

Feel free to continue this conversation via PM or by e-mail [email protected].

 

[Shadow]

Interesting about Histamine and SSRI @Area-1255, I dindt knew about it! My ED problems started right after my hives, which are better now. I think that @gbolduev talked some times about Histamine.

My last blood test is here(morning) https://hackstasis.com/threads/my-blood-tests-pssd.236/

About other problems, Im 99% sure that I have nothing wrong. This shit started only when I stopped the meds, and I have seen at least other 2 cases very similar to mine. Its something that I cant understand, why while on meds we are "ok" maybe with some sides, and only after stopping it things go nuts.

 

[Area-1255]

Interesting about Histamine and SSRI @Area-1255, I dindt knew about it! My ED problems started right after my hives, which are better now. I think that @gbolduev talked some times about Histamine.

My last blood test is here(morning) https://hackstasis.com/threads/my-blood-tests-pssd.236/

About other problems, Im 99% sure that I have nothing wrong. This **** started only when I stopped the meds, and I have seen at least other 2 cases very similar to mine. Its something that I cant understand, why while on meds we are "ok" maybe with some sides, and only after stopping it things go nuts.

Yeah and also there are additional studies on Histamine specifically in regards to erectile function IN HUMANS.
Histamine H1-receptors appear to inhibit erection whereas H2 and H3 receptors promote erection.
H2 seems to do it by activating cAMP (like Forskolin) whereas H3-activation decreases norepinephrinergic drive; leading to enhanced vasodiilation.

Br J Urol. 1995 Feb;75(2):220-4.
The role of histamine in human penile erection.
Cará AM1, Lopes-Martins RA, Antunes E, Nahoum CR, De Nucci G.
Author information
Abstract
OBJECTIVE:
To investigate the relaxant action of histamine on human corpus cavernosum in vitro and the erectile response caused by the intracavernous injection of histamine in patients with psychogenic impotence.

PATIENTS AND METHODS:
Human corpus cavernosum (HCC) tissue was cut into strips of approximately 2 cm and suspended in a cascade bioassay. The strips were then superfused with oxygenated and warmed Krebs solution and precontracted with noradrenaline (3 microM). Glyceryl trinitrate, acetylcholine and histamine were injected as a single bolus in the absence or in the presence of mepyramine and cimetidine. For the in vivo studies, histamine (30-60 micrograms) was injected intracavernously as a single bolus into the right corpus cavernosum 1 cm from the balamo-preputial sulcus. Similar protocols were carried out for papaverine (50 mg). The erectile response was divided into four grades: no response, tumescence, partial and full erection.

RESULTS:
In vitro studies demonstrated that histamine (3-100 micrograms) caused dose-dependent relaxation of the HCC strips which was significantly inhibited by cimetidine (5-10 microM). The histamine H1 receptor antagonist mepyramine (1 microM) potentiated histamine-induced relaxation. The co-infusion of both mepyramine and cimetidine did not abolish histamine-induced relaxation. When injected intracavernously in humans, histamine (30 micrograms) caused full erection in 13% of the patients, whereas 87% had partial erection or tumescence. A higher dose of histamine (60 micrograms) caused full erection in 26% of the patients and 74% had partial erection or tumescence. Papaverine induced full erection in the majority of patients (66%). In contrast to papaverine, the duration of erection induced by histamine was markedly shorter (mean 200 and 6.5 min, respectively). The penile erections induced by papaverine were associated with complications such as pain, haematoma and priapism. Histamine did not induce any complications. Treatment of eight male patients with psychogenic impotence with the histamine H1 receptor antagonist astemizol (10 mg orally once daily for 1 week) did not affect histamine-induced erectile responses.

CONCLUSION:
These results indicate that histamine may play a role in human penile erection. The erection-promoting action of histamine is probably due to H2 receptor activation, although another histamine receptor, possibly H3, also seems to be involved. This study suggests that histamine could be a valuable tool in the diagnosis of erectile dysfunction.

PMID: 7850330

 

[Helen]

@Area-1255
http://encognitive.com/files/Histidine-GLA-Zinc Complex to Block Pain & Inflammation in Treatment-resistant Sydromes_0.pdf

I posted this before, all these problems are histidine cysteine balance. copper zinc.

Very hard to fix once a person goes into alkalosis with volume depletion. Like in this case. cypro just tanks acth. which will tank the whole axis, he is already low on sodium and potassium. Never understood people who take cypro. unless you want to get fat. they basically just tank their thyroid effect and of course with cortisol insensitivity they feel better on slower thyroid. same as copper , same as calcium. All tank thyroid effect Aspirin tanks thyroid. Funny that Ray peat recommends all those to increase metabolism. THYROID effect= T3 hormones plus potassium in the cell. So t3 could be high potassium low= SMALL effect from thyroid.

YOu can decrease cortisol 2 ways. Either make it more sensitive. which lowers its level and increases metabolism, since rt3 hormone goes down.. or you tank potassium in the cell, which is what cypro , dhea, acids do. This lowers cortisol since it is not needed, but your thyroid effect is lowered.

 

[Area-1255]

@Area-1255
http://encognitive.com/files/Histidine-GLA-Zinc Complex to Block Pain & Inflammation in Treatment-resistant Sydromes_0.pdf

I posted this before, all these problems are histidine cysteine balance. copper zinc.

Very hard to fix once a person goes into alkalosis with volume depletion. Like in this case. cypro just tanks acth. which will tank the whole axis, he is already low on sodium and potassium. Never understood people who take cypro. unless you want to get fat. they basically just tank their thyroid effect and of course with cortisol insensitivity they feel better on slower thyroid. same as copper , same as calcium. All tank thyroid effect Aspirin tanks thyroid. Funny that Ray peat recommends all those to increase metabolism. THYROID effect= T3 hormones plus potassium in the cell. So t3 could be high potassium low= SMALL effect from thyroid.

YOu can decrease cortisol 2 ways. Either make it more sensitive. which lowers its level and increases metabolism, since rt3 hormone goes down.. or you tank potassium in the cell, which is what cypro , dhea, acids do. This lowers cortisol since it is not needed, but your thyroid effect is lowered.

Those are some good points. Its also possible to lower histamine level by using Green Tea/EGCG.
EGCG and Epicatechin Inhibit Human Histamine Synthase

 

[TubZy]

@Area-1255
http://encognitive.com/files/Histidine-GLA-Zinc Complex to Block Pain & Inflammation in Treatment-resistant Sydromes_0.pdf

I posted this before, all these problems are histidine cysteine balance. copper zinc.

Very hard to fix once a person goes into alkalosis with volume depletion. Like in this case. cypro just tanks acth. which will tank the whole axis, he is already low on sodium and potassium. Never understood people who take cypro. unless you want to get fat. they basically just tank their thyroid effect and of course with cortisol insensitivity they feel better on slower thyroid. same as copper , same as calcium. All tank thyroid effect Aspirin tanks thyroid. Funny that Ray peat recommends all those to increase metabolism. THYROID effect= T3 hormones plus potassium in the cell. So t3 could be high potassium low= SMALL effect from thyroid.

YOu can decrease cortisol 2 ways. Either make it more sensitive. which lowers its level and increases metabolism, since rt3 hormone goes down.. or you tank potassium in the cell, which is what cypro , dhea, acids do. This lowers cortisol since it is not needed, but your thyroid effect is lowered.

Since hisitidine increases zinc absorption does cysteine increase copper absorption?

 

[Area-1255]

Since hisitidine increases zinc absorption does cysteine increase copper absorption?

Actually Histidine increases Copper uptake and removal as well. They both contribute to metallothein-related proteins/carriers. Cysteine seems to effect whole blood and tissue Copper, but it is unclear whether this effect is one if its primary mechanisms. It probably just regenerates the antioxidant-dependent metal removal systems. But I'm betting NAC would do better at that even.
NAC's got plenty of other benefits too!

 

[Shadow]

Update about my condition.
The itchy/irritant nerve feeling in my pelvic area ( SSRI, PGAD and Acetylcholine ) subsided, and I noticed some things that I wish to share.

During the worsened condition:
-> Tinnitus and Hyperacusis was better, the same sensation in my jaw was better.
-> Restless leg syndrome was better.
-> Erection was better.

After the condition subsided:
-> The same sensation in my jaw was back, as well as the "normal" levels of tinnitus and hyperacusis.
-> Mild stabbing pain in my ears.
-> Restless leg virtually gone.
-> Erections and libido improved.

I think that the same thing that is causing this itch/irritatation sensation in my pelvic nerves is the same that is causing my hearing problem, since I have a very similar sensation in my jaw/trigeminal. Another good finding was that if I put pressure on the nerves by pushing my hands agains my temples the tinnitus spike! And after I release the pressure it alleviates a bit.

When my sensitivity started to get impaired, I felt THE SAME itchy nerve feeling, but in the ring and pinkie finger(ulnar nerve?), from both of my hands AND feet. What is even more interestinf is that I saw the freaking same pattern of numbness on other people.

My tinnitus is very high pitched, sometimes I heard a pulsatile too, along with it, a very unconfortable feeling in my jaws.

What the hell happened to my nerves! What can be causing this kind of thing? Damn, I just want to have at leats some peace of mind...

@gbolduev do you think that the things we discussed here (zinc finger, prog, alkalosis) can be involved in this crap?

 

[Canari]

I remember reading something about nerves pain and copper.

I talked about it with someone, because he is many years vegan (so probable high copper low zinc) and he got trigemini nerve pain up to eating only smoothies for some days, after taking LSD.

If I understand well, you are a little better now?

 

[Shadow]

I remember reading something about nerves pain and copper.

I talked about it with someone, because he is many years vegan (so probable high copper low zinc) and he got trigemini nerve pain up to eating only smoothies for some days, after taking LSD.

If I understand well, you are a little better now?

better from the pelvic annoyance, but worse from this jaw/ear crap... how could a drug do this kind of thing, and only after stopping it, this is what I found more weird

 

[Canari]

how could a drug do this kind of thing, and only after stopping it, this is what I found more weird

Shadow, I have some real knowledge that is educational and not only about personal reading. A drug that hurts will have more effect on the persons that have some nervous sensitivity before, and I do not talk there about psychology, but physiology of the nervous system. I know I cannot give a fast working tip, but understanding how it works can give you an idea of the steps to take, apart from rebalancing yourself. I can asure you that the image of phoenix rising from its ashes has a meaning, and that I have lived it sometimes, and that you can rise as much better than you would have been and be grateful for the past difficulties! I know you are not grateful now, and that the path can seem too long. Have you figured out what protocol can be right for you? Have you done the necessary analysis to help you choose before trying? You want to give yourself time to choose with the most chance to nail it on your target!

But now, I tell you why I quoted this sentence from you... I have noticed you ask this often, which is normal, because this should not be. I tell it here to you, but I am sure many others aer in the same case, and are ANGRY! If you keep your focus on this question, it will block you short-sighted on it. You cannot either just ignore it, there is something else to do with it... so that this question does not bother you anymore, and gives you focus, more focus, on the path of the future. Questions about this past act of taking a drug do not bring answer for solutions. I would bet that this question comes to your thinking because you are more than puzzled and finding it weird! Don't you think, in your place I would, that you are very angry that doctors let people take stuff without checking better about the side effects?

This I am sure about what I say, when an emotion is big, it is too devastating to let it go out (we all know what very angry people who do not control it can do!), so we keep it more or less asleep. But it typically shows up as questions, especially recurrent thoughts. This type of thoughts is a sign you can use for self-informations. thoughts come because of emotions, and difficult emotions come from unsuccessful fight and flight. You could not go away from the drug inside you, and your body did not have the right chemistry to fight it and eliminate it properly, maybe liver and kidneys were not strong enough, so they failed. So of course there is some emotions, maybe some anger after doctors, but maybe after yourself. Maybe sometimes we say inside "How can I have been so stupid to follow this advice." lol I apply it to me! how can I have been so stupid to believe that sugar and dairies and taking progesterone were going to be a solution for me?!?!?!?" These emotions are important to be considered and observed and pet and cuddled, so that they can go alone. You cannot throw them out of the door, they will come back by the window. Thoughts are signs of this. If you can process the emotions little by little, I can assure you your thoughts will have more energy.

We have one big victory here, there is a rising forum, and it is a victory to have been able to let RPF backward and go ahead! When a recuring question about past mistakes comes, it is good to find a positive reaction. like "ok, I have been misled during a lot of time, that is done, but now I have taken a better path." It is automatic to have defensive thoughts about what hurt us, and it is NOT automatic to be grateful to what helps! We need tot hink about the second. The reason is ok: our nervous system is made to be automatic for all what has to do with defense! That is why meditation has to be done on purpose. Nobody meditates automatically.... but everybody ruminates without having to think about it! "How could a drug do this kind of thing" is an automatic defense. Some meditation about gratefulness toward hackstasis can help fight the rumination, after all, we are not cows not sheeep! lol i always like jokes...

 

[Helen]

@Shadow I thought about you , I think your condition is connected to manganese levels. I am yet to figure out the protocol.

I think PSSD could be tried to be beat with manganese plus magnesium. I think those 2 will make the body more sensitive to serotonin.

Enhancement of agonist binding to 5-HT1A receptors in rat brain membranes by millimolar Mn2+. - PubMed - NCBI

Also I think magnesium will decrease aldosterone, and manganese will decrease 3 beta hsd.( progesterone)

Also manganese is used to treat tinnitus