the water fasting thread (therapies and refeeding only)

[Slayo]

Here i would like to discuss therapies that can be done during a water fast to improve the results, as well as a correct and detailed refeeding.

THERAPIES:

-infrared light on the liver, kidney, fat tissues and any part of the body that requires healing: using it on detox organs will upregulate enzymes needed to detox as well as bile flow that can help prevent sibo that can take place during a fasting since there isn't much bile flow. Using it on fat tissue may help increase the metabolism locally and push fatty acids in circulation where hopefully the body will use it as a fuel instead of muscles.

-sauna: can help clean the blood that during a fast will be full of toxins, just be carefull to not overdo as it can be dangerous

-chi machine or any other machine that moves your body: it is crucial to move your lymphatic system, and if you don't want to exercise this is crucial to do, better to use it before sauna. You can have massages too.

-bravo suppositories: i feel healing the gut is crucial to do during the fast and you can't just pick up any random probiotic and use it. Probiotics have specific functions on immune system and other systems as well so taking them randomly will unbalance you, this is why i only recommend bravo probiotics as they are the strongest and most balanced form of probiotics on the market (and the only ones that have given me results). The only thing that bother me a little is that they have 0,28mg of ribovlavin, 0,28mg of b6, and 40 mcg of folic acid will they cause any problem umbalancing us during the fasting @Helen ? Take one a day before bed.
This step is crucial as the probiotic will not only heal the gut but will also detox metals and fight infections, they are taken up by machrofages and lymphocytes and carried through the lymphatic system to the brain, so taking them will help clean the lymphatic system and the brain as well.
Here the link: Bravo Probiotic - Suppositories (12 pack)

-meditation

THERAPHIES I'M NOT SO SURE IF THEY WILL WORK OR ARE SAFE DURING FASTING:

-oxygen im injections or big autohemotheraphy ozone: will they increase oxidative stress or the body will be able to upregulate antioxidants even more boosting the results of the fasting ?





REFEEDING:

About this topic i don't have enough knowleadge, i just know that it is crucial to avoid to induce P deficency that will crash your metabolism and make you worse than the beginning, so i think it is crucial to avoid carbs during the first days of refeeding.
Also the calories should be increased gradually.
I would like that someone enough skilled will write a detailed refeeding plan listing the grams of foods and how to increase calories, maybe @Helen can do this.

I encourage anyone that has good ideas to partecipate on this thread as water fasting is the most powerfull theraphy and improving its success with some therapies and a correct refeeding is crucial.
First thing i would like to discuss about is if the small about of those 3 vitamins in the bravo suppositories are ok and if the oxygen/ozone therapies are ok as well, then if you have other therapies please list them so we can research them and see if they are suitable to be added to the theraphies list.

The goal is to have a complete water fasting guide where people that want to fast can check it and try the therapies and refeeding listed being 100% sure they will improve the results and not obstacle them.


@mattyb @Boris @bruschi11 @MNK99

 

[bruschi11]

Yes. Amazing thread

“Things to do and things not to do” lists while fasting would be great.

Enemas? Some people love daily enemas or colonics while fasting to help remove toxins. Some people advise against. Coffee too.

Probiotic enemas? I used visbiome nightly during my 21 day fast. My gut went from bad to amazing afterward. I did 16 Oz of visbiome enemas and I’d hold them in. Did these really help me? Or was it just the fast itself I wonder sometimes.

Rife machine, frequency healing, ionic footbaths. Salt water swimming or salt water/ magnesium baths.

I bought oscillation Device and use this while inhaling oxygen. I use this to battle my Lyme / mycoplasma Disease. Should I use this while fasting?

Many questions that can be answered here. Or we can talk from experience.

@freeflow has had a lot of success from fasting here as well. @MNK99 @Nina @Grambo @Orion

 

[Orion]

Here is Mattyb's refeed thoughts and ideals, this has been posted many time:

Mattyb breaking fast protocol:

Days 1-7

Focus on mineral intake, particularly magnesium, sodium and potassium
Calories will still be low at this point, you'll likely regain some water weight but continue to lose fat
Vegetable broths, soups, well cooked vegetables, cooked leafy greens, etc.
Maybe some rice
Minimal herbs/spices
A bit of fats (eggs, butter) mixed in with the soups
Not very much protein, if any
Introduce food/calories slowly

Days 7-21
Anything from days 1-7 would be fine
Calorie intake will be slightly low, trending towards maintenance near the third week
Fresh vegetables and greens marinated in olive oil/vinegar
Some herbs/spices
More rice, maybe some well-cooked oats, small amounts of fruit, possibly small amounts of tubers
Small amounts of well cooked meat/seafood daily (slow roasted would be a good option)
Increase fat and protein gradually to get pancreas and gallbladder up to speed over these two weeks.

Days 21+
Everything from before is fine
Calories should be around maintenance near this point
By this point you should be able to exercise easily
More fruit, more carbohydrates (according to activity levels)
More foods high in manganese (oats, cereals, etc.) if well tolerated
More meat (and/or supplement zinc)
Tubers could be introduced if well tolerated
Should be hitting near the RDA of most vitamins/minerals by this point, with maybe the exception of calcium and vitamins e/d.

If digestion is robust at this point you can likely eat whatever your intuition is pushing you towards

High chloride greens - spinach, chard, beet greens, dandelion greens, and pea shoots are my go to. Sometimes I will mix in more mild greens like butterhead and romaine lettuces. Typically, the more bitter the better. I would sometimes even add salt to the salad for additional chloride.

No, not aspirin. Aspirin is a salicylate, which can stimulate the respiratory center and induce respiratory alkalosis.

Dietary acid loads would come from things like fatty acids, protein (particularly glutamate/aspartate, and maybe cysteine), vinegar (don't overdo it with this, very hard on the teeth and esophagus), HCl supplements, and ammonium chloride supplements - this list is in order from least intense to most intense therapy. Then if you pair this up with lots of water to increase urinary mineral excretion, sweating from exercise/saunas, and maybe even blood donations, you could accelerate the mineral loss. While doing this you'll want to replace essential minerals like chloride, sodium, magnesium, and potassium (lots of greens and salt are good for this) while minimizing calcium and iron intake. Zinc/copper/Mn will depend on which one you're high in, but I think replacing those can wait until you're done with the chelation. Then after all this is done you can increase iron, cysteine and methionine intake and hopefully it takes into hair with some physical stimulation from massage.

 

[Slayo]

Yes. Amazing thread

“Things to do and things not to do” lists while fasting would be great.

Enemas? Some people love daily enemas or colonics while fasting, some don’t.

Probiotic enemas? I used visbiome nightly during my 21 day fast. My gut went from bad to amazing afterward.

about enams during fasting i haven't a good opinion about them, they get rid of electrolytes so they may be dangerous for some people (for example just doing one will send me to the er due to low sodium)

about probiotics suppositories i suggested the bravo suppositories as they are 42 strains of BALANCED probiotics

 

[Slayo]

Here is Mattyb's refeed thoughts and ideals, this has been posted many time:

Mattyb breaking fast protocol:

Days 1-7

Focus on mineral intake, particularly magnesium, sodium and potassium
Calories will still be low at this point, you'll likely regain some water weight but continue to lose fat
Vegetable broths, soups, well cooked vegetables, cooked leafy greens, etc.
Maybe some rice
Minimal herbs/spices
A bit of fats (eggs, butter) mixed in with the soups
Not very much protein, if any
Introduce food/calories slowly

Days 7-21
Anything from days 1-7 would be fine
Calorie intake will be slightly low, trending towards maintenance near the third week
Fresh vegetables and greens marinated in olive oil/vinegar
Some herbs/spices
More rice, maybe some well-cooked oats, small amounts of fruit, possibly small amounts of tubers
Small amounts of well cooked meat/seafood daily (slow roasted would be a good option)
Increase fat and protein gradually to get pancreas and gallbladder up to speed over these two weeks.

Days 21+
Everything from before is fine
Calories should be around maintenance near this point
By this point you should be able to exercise easily
More fruit, more carbohydrates (according to activity levels)
More foods high in manganese (oats, cereals, etc.) if well tolerated
More meat (and/or supplement zinc)
Tubers could be introduced if well tolerated
Should be hitting near the RDA of most vitamins/minerals by this point, with maybe the exception of calcium and vitamins e/d.

If digestion is robust at this point you can likely eat whatever your intuition is pushing you towards

High chloride greens - spinach, chard, beet greens, dandelion greens, and pea shoots are my go to. Sometimes I will mix in more mild greens like butterhead and romaine lettuces. Typically, the more bitter the better. I would sometimes even add salt to the salad for additional chloride.

No, not aspirin. Aspirin is a salicylate, which can stimulate the respiratory center and induce respiratory alkalosis.

Dietary acid loads would come from things like fatty acids, protein (particularly glutamate/aspartate, and maybe cysteine), vinegar (don't overdo it with this, very hard on the teeth and esophagus), HCl supplements, and ammonium chloride supplements - this list is in order from least intense to most intense therapy. Then if you pair this up with lots of water to increase urinary mineral excretion, sweating from exercise/saunas, and maybe even blood donations, you could accelerate the mineral loss. While doing this you'll want to replace essential minerals like chloride, sodium, magnesium, and potassium (lots of greens and salt are good for this) while minimizing calcium and iron intake. Zinc/copper/Mn will depend on which one you're high in, but I think replacing those can wait until you're done with the chelation. Then after all this is done you can increase iron, cysteine and methionine intake and hopefully it takes into hair with some physical stimulation from massage.

it's a good start, but we need somenthing more detailed like total calories for each days, etc, basically a meal sample for each range of days would be the best, this will cut the changes to get fucked up by the refeeding, a perfect refeeding is crucial and i lived myself the consequences of a wrong refeeding.

somenthing like: day 1-5 x grams of this food, etc would be the best

A thing i would stress about is no sugar and carbs at at all at the beginning, better safe than sorry

 

[TubZy]

You guys ever try dry fasting? Supposedly, it is like way faster than water fasting

 

[Orion]

You guys ever try dry fasting? Supposedly, it is like way faster than water fasting

Doing a long fast now, thinking I might try a few dry days throughout, if I don't feel too run down.

 

[jacknap]

You guys ever try dry fasting? Supposedly, it is like way faster than water fasting

yo shit looks unreal good benefits wise. I did a 24 hour one and I definitely felt my body heat up. was too scared to go too long though.

iread the book on it there's a lot of russian data on it. maybe good old @Helen knows things on this.

this one pua I follow on youtube did a 7 day one and the guy has very crisp thought energy. eddie phews i believe his name is. he has a 20 min video on it.

apparently and can cure cancers/aids etc. if i ever get aids would consider doing it tho ideally never get aids lmao

 

[MNK99]

--i get so dehydrated just explaining my life to ppl that ask, need water. or... also gotta cool down. wearing tshirt minus 10.
--dry fast id probably faint eventually. but i could go long*. but i won't. Bc i don't wanna.

-- @jacknap No aids in canada tho rite?? RITE?

 

[jacknap]

--i get so dehydrated just explaining my life to ppl that ask, need water. or... also gotta cool down. wearing tshirt minus 10.
--dry fast id probably faint eventually. but i could go long*. but i won't. Bc i don't wanna.

-- @jacknap No aids in canada tho rite?? RITE?

there is but much lower levels.

wow didn't know garbage trucks kill people in toronto. i dont relaly follow the news but I'll be wary of them near me. is the garbage men dieing or are the killing male pedestrians?

 

[MNK99]

Killing pedestrians.
Toronto drivers are so aggressive.
"Leading cause" may be a bit misleading.

 

[jacknap]

Killing pedestrians.
Toronto drivers are so aggressive.
"Leading cause" may be a bit misleading.

find toronto drivers pretty tame compared to montreal and greece

 

[Slayo]

Here is Mattyb's refeed thoughts and ideals, this has been posted many time:

Mattyb breaking fast protocol:

Days 1-7

Focus on mineral intake, particularly magnesium, sodium and potassium
Calories will still be low at this point, you'll likely regain some water weight but continue to lose fat
Vegetable broths, soups, well cooked vegetables, cooked leafy greens, etc.
Maybe some rice
Minimal herbs/spices
A bit of fats (eggs, butter) mixed in with the soups
Not very much protein, if any
Introduce food/calories slowly

Days 7-21
Anything from days 1-7 would be fine
Calorie intake will be slightly low, trending towards maintenance near the third week
Fresh vegetables and greens marinated in olive oil/vinegar
Some herbs/spices
More rice, maybe some well-cooked oats, small amounts of fruit, possibly small amounts of tubers
Small amounts of well cooked meat/seafood daily (slow roasted would be a good option)
Increase fat and protein gradually to get pancreas and gallbladder up to speed over these two weeks.

Days 21+
Everything from before is fine
Calories should be around maintenance near this point
By this point you should be able to exercise easily
More fruit, more carbohydrates (according to activity levels)
More foods high in manganese (oats, cereals, etc.) if well tolerated
More meat (and/or supplement zinc)
Tubers could be introduced if well tolerated
Should be hitting near the RDA of most vitamins/minerals by this point, with maybe the exception of calcium and vitamins e/d.

If digestion is robust at this point you can likely eat whatever your intuition is pushing you towards

High chloride greens - spinach, chard, beet greens, dandelion greens, and pea shoots are my go to. Sometimes I will mix in more mild greens like butterhead and romaine lettuces. Typically, the more bitter the better. I would sometimes even add salt to the salad for additional chloride.

No, not aspirin. Aspirin is a salicylate, which can stimulate the respiratory center and induce respiratory alkalosis.

Dietary acid loads would come from things like fatty acids, protein (particularly glutamate/aspartate, and maybe cysteine), vinegar (don't overdo it with this, very hard on the teeth and esophagus), HCl supplements, and ammonium chloride supplements - this list is in order from least intense to most intense therapy. Then if you pair this up with lots of water to increase urinary mineral excretion, sweating from exercise/saunas, and maybe even blood donations, you could accelerate the mineral loss. While doing this you'll want to replace essential minerals like chloride, sodium, magnesium, and potassium (lots of greens and salt are good for this) while minimizing calcium and iron intake. Zinc/copper/Mn will depend on which one you're high in, but I think replacing those can wait until you're done with the chelation. Then after all this is done you can increase iron, cysteine and methionine intake and hopefully it takes into hair with some physical stimulation from massage.

@mattyb please, can you be more precise about calories ? You say low calories, can you give us some numbers about calories in the 1-7, 7-21+ range ? Because low calories is pretty subjective, it is <500 or what ? Thanks

 

[Slayo]

i agree with this post:

https://www.reddit.com/r/fasting/comments/8jcqou

people that break the fast with watermelon are crazy, i think we should keep ketosis for a while during the refeed and slowly breaking it up

 

[bruschi11]

when are you fasting @Slayo ? I’m beginning Monday the latest.

 

[Slayo]

Lol when are you fasting @Slayo ? I’m beginning Monday the latest.

in some weeks, read my log

 

[happenstance]

Urine fast? The original refeeding.

 

[raven]

Yes. Amazing thread

“Things to do and things not to do” lists while fasting would be great.

Enemas? Some people love daily enemas or colonics while fasting to help remove toxins. Some people advise against. Coffee too.

Probiotic enemas? I used visbiome nightly during my 21 day fast. My gut went from bad to amazing afterward. I did 16 Oz of visbiome enemas and I’d hold them in. Did these really help me? Or was it just the fast itself I wonder sometimes.

Rife machine, frequency healing, ionic footbaths. Salt water swimming or salt water/ magnesium baths.

I bought oscillation Device and use this while inhaling oxygen. I use this to battle my Lyme / mycoplasma Disease. Should I use this while fasting?

Many questions that can be answered here. Or we can talk from experience.

@freeflow has had a lot of success from fasting here as well. @MNK99 @Nina @Grambo @Orion

interesting, @Helen was saying once that probiotic enemas are far better than taking probiotics in supplement form because the small intestine isn't meant to be exposed to any bacteria, even good bacteria, so taking probiotics by pill can make SIBO worse

 

[sanka]

If fast can cure everything, why it cant help us with pfs ?

 

[bruschi11]

Day 3 of what is supposed to be 25 day fast.

I went to have colonic today at mineral balancing holistic health center I went to during summer. The naturalist there Carolann who I mentioned in past wanted me to have sodium bicarbonate IV done for me. And to do this weekly during the fast.

I don’t know if this can effect fast negatively. Can it @Helen ? The colonic and sodium bicarbonate made me feel a million times better I will say that. Before that I was struggling bad lol.

I’m doing 14 days of water / herbal teas/ herbs. And jumping to 16 Oz breuss daily for days 15 to 25. I’m doing Dead Sea salt baths EOD or so. My Lyme Chinese herbs daily. Using oscillation device while inhaling oxygen. Plan to do probiotic enemas on majority of nights coming up. Also planning to use rife machine a bit and seeing how it affects me.

This is really just a Lyme fast I’m trying here. I kind of did it last year on my 21 days where I used a lot of herbals, probiotic enemas, magnesium baths.

We will see how it goes. I’m hoping I can tolerate betaine hcl afterward to help digestion. Betaine hcl like made me go last year- it really was my life saver.

We shall see. Looking forward to the end of this fast lol. These things aren’t the funnest time periods in life haha.