ZINC FINGER THEORY DISCUSSION for PFS - 2 cases

[bruschi11]

@TubZy @gbolduev @mattyb or anyone that can help me here.

When we say we want to tank potassium in the cell, what is the exact reason for doing so? Do we want to lower it so when it comes back it comes back stronger?

I'm a huge Betaine HCL guy right now along with making sure I go high on potassium (tomato juice, beet juice etc etc). Just would like to see a link or clarification as to why I am doing this.

 

[raven]

@bruschi11 It doesn't seem to be with TE or ARL which are the two main labs, the most reputable ones. It's hard to tell really, I've heard that some of these smaller labs wash the hair and do other stuff to it that muddy the results..

 

[tanedout]

@bruschi11 It doesn't seem to be with TE or ARL which are the two main labs, the most reputable ones. It's hard to tell really, I've heard that some of these smaller labs wash the hair and do other stuff to it that muddy the results..

Would be pretty interesting for someone to get a hair analysis from both TE and ARL taking hair samples for both on the same day. See how the results from both labs compare!

 

[Orion]

When we say we want to tank potassium in the cell, what is the exact reason for doing so? Do we want to lower it so when it comes back it comes back stronger?

I think it has to do with thyroid, potassium in the cell and sodium on the outside need to be balanced for thyroid to function optimally, when potassium is sky high or low, it disrupts this.

 

[bruschi11]

@bruschi11 It doesn't seem to be with TE or ARL which are the two main labs, the most reputable ones. It's hard to tell really, I've heard that some of these smaller labs wash the hair and do other stuff to it that muddy the results..

Thanks Raven. I'll take that into account with results. I just had it done. @freeflow referred me to that link back in September and I ordered it then. Any reason for that particular lab @freeflow ?

I'm sure the results won't differ too much to make a drastic difference. We'll see, I'm not going crazy about it.

 

[Flynn]

OK, does anyone have a link to the paper which talks about finasteride being a progestin or derived from progesterone? If Fin truly is a progestin (I'm only questioning this as I've not seen or read about this anywhere other than this forum), then Gbol's work to link Fin to things like deca dick was fantastic work and a great help to the community.

It also makes sense that some people are more sensitive to the effects of progesterone than others, as some people get deca dick whilst others do not.

I don't really understand all the potassium in the cell stuff and how we know this would effect receptor expression as gbol states. Again I haven't seen any evidence that potassium levels etc. inside the cell effect whether receptors such as progesterone receptors are up or down regulated.

 

[bruschi11]

OK, does anyone have a link to the paper which talks about finasteride being a progestin or derived from progesterone? If Fin truly is a progestin (I'm only questioning this as I've not seen or read about this anywhere other than this forum), then Gbol's work to link Fin to things like deca **** was fantastic work and a great help to the community.

It also makes sense that some people are more sensitive to the effects of progesterone than others, as some people get deca **** whilst others do not.

I don't really understand all the potassium in the cell stuff and how we know this would effect receptor expression as gbol states. Again I haven't seen any evidence that potassium levels etc. inside the cell effect whether receptors such as progesterone receptors are up or down regulated.

Fin is definitely a progestin. Finasteride is located in the human body, that chemical is something that is naturally in us. But what we did was put wayyyy too much of it inside of us. I wonder what the actual ratio of what we actually have naturally vs. what propecia is.

Gotta understand that all hormones have pathways. Fin and Accutane are just end products to hormonal pathways. We just flooded the end of a hormonal pathway with way too much of these. They caused all sorts of backlash.

I'm glad we have guys that understand this a lot better than me, but I do understand the whole principle here.

 

[MNK99]

https://imgur.com/a/muNDz

It's on my blog too.


Lednicer, D. Antineoplastic Drugs: Organic Synthesis. 2015. "The starting material for the synthesis of finasteride is progesterone…” pp.47

I took those screenshots of Danny Roddy's video

 

[Sam90]

Does anyone know how this relates to ssri's? Are the progestins too?

 

[Nina]

Does anyone know how this relates to ssri's? Are the progestins too?

I believe gbolduev said ssri increase serotonin, which increases acth which then increases cortisol and causes you to waste potassium thus i think progesterone would go up to try and retain potassium.. This is just my theory though, not 100% sure what gbol wrote.

 

[Canari]

Would be pretty interesting for someone to get a hair analysis from both TE and ARL taking hair samples for both on the same day. See how the results from both labs compare!

I was tempted.... I kept some hair from the moment I cut some for TEI....

@gbolduev you said the labs could make mistakes: have you seen if one makes less than the other? Do you know if results come back the same, especially about supplements advices?

 

[Shadow]

Does anyone know how this relates to ssri's? Are the progestins too?

All that I know is that SSRIs directly affect the conversion of 5a-Dihydroprogesterone to Allopregnanolone by 3a-HSD.

But SSRIs are used as an alternative to hormonal replacement in women, hotflashes and all that stuff, so, I think that directly or inderectly they end up messing with progesterone too

 

[Sam90]

All that I know is that SSRIs directly affect the conversion of 5a-Dihydroprogesterone to Allopregnanolone by 3a-HSD.

But SSRIs are used as an alternative to hormonal replacement in women, hotflashes and all that stuff, so, I think that directly or inderectly they end up messing with progesterone too

Yeah that was my understanding I'm just unsure how or why. And what that would mean post ssri. I read that SSRIs initially raise Allo. But I feel that this isn't sustainable over months/years and I feel I had low Allo symptoms after a year, social numbness and emotional dysfunction etc. Maybe if we get prog working again the Allo issue will resolve itself.

 

[Shadow]

Yeah that was my understanding I'm just unsure how or why. And what that would mean post ssri. I read that SSRIs initially raise Allo. But I feel that this isn't sustainable over months/years and I feel I had low Allo symptoms after a year, social numbness and emotional dysfunction etc. Maybe if we get prog working again the Allo issue will resolve itself.

At long term allo production is reduced.

 

[Aleksandr]

To follow up what Ihatefin said, finasteride is a progestin, this is a fact there is actually a published paper showing exactly how finasteride is made e.g. derived from progesterone. The 5ARi component of it is something way downstream of all the other types of things it does mainly with progesterone, potassium, cortisol etc. so when people keep referring it to as a 5ARi, it simply is not in that class, that is just one of the many things it does and by just focusing on simply "increasing" 5AR directly will never fix the problem (as seen by the overwhelming anecdotal evidence of just trying to increase 5AR).

All of the treatments mentioned in the experimental treatment thread are all related, they just address it in different ways. RU, ella etc. all tank potassium in the cell just like how betaine can also tank potassium in the cell for example. The difference with zinc finger is that is it a much higher up approach. You are literally jumpstarting your entire system from digestion. That is why amino acids like histidine increase HCL (stomach acid) or directly would be adding betaine HCL with electrolytes and this allows you to start retaining minerals and electrolytes again. If you see the thread in my signature about "general health" you can check that out and understand why too. This is why zinc finger is more capable of being able to address multiple issues since it starts so high up in the process compared to something more direct like RU/ella. It really comes down to acidosis vs alkalosis.

What do you mean general health in your signature?

 

[Aleksandr]

Hair Elements Test - HE (WITH Dr. Amy's Comments)

Just cut my hair and did hair mineral test with site above. Back of my head has some patches lol. Anybody know if this test above is ok?

Also regarding zinc finger, I think the "Eidon Mineral Electrolytes" are crucial for anyone experiencing with it. They seem to really make a difference for me.

Seems like a pyramid scheme, what's in the eidon?

 

[TubZy]

What do you mean general health in your signature?

Sorry forgot the title got changed, it is "improved" health
Protocol & Guide for Improved Health

 

[Aleksandr]

Sorry forgot the title got changed, it is "improved" health
Protocol & Guide for Improved Health

You have shown me da wae

 

[Canari]

Seems like a pyramid scheme, what's in the eidon?

I was connecting now just to show this page Hair Test Results and Analysis; What is it telling you?
and as it just happen to be eidon website and as all talks are in this thread...
I came across their website through iherb while looking for a copper supplement... Eidon sells many liquid minerals, thus with no fillers.

I think their description of hair ratios are very clear.

 

[PFStinks]

@Scenes I've been using potassium, copper, magnesium and NAC (cysteine) together and i feel much better than before. Although my heart-rate is a little increased and my body temperature feels slightly warmer than before, what do you think about moving on to the GHK-cu regimine you're doing? Is there much added benefit?