ZINC FINGER THEORY DISCUSSION for PFS - 2 cases

[Orion]

I think dosages of HCl that I wrote could likely be much higher for some people though.

How high do you think is good to try, I think I will go up from 6grams/meal, tyw over on RPF threads stated that up to 30grams per dose is considered safe.

 

[freeflow]

When potassium gets tanked, the body looks for more potassium. If it can't get it, it will induce 3 beta HSD instead which will increase progesterone which you don't want. When that happens, this will increase progesterone and down regulate progesterone receptors (in which your receptors are already down regulated from taking a progestin AKA finasteride).

When you take potassium at the same time as something that tanks it, you are feeding your body potassium at that given moment. So instead of inducing 3 beta HSD, the body will use the potassium that you are supplementing with. This will prevent progesterone from increasing which will then up-regulate prog receptors, which you want. In other words, making it more sensitive.

Same concept as fasting. Hormones drops during the fast (testosterone, progesterone, insulin etc.) and this causes upregulation. This is the reason why you get a huge hormone spike post fast, I posted some studies on it before. That is the reason why fasting helps with diabetes and improving insulin sensitivity by having low levels of insulin constantly during the fast, this increases insulin sensitivity greatly so when you come off the fast your body is now more sensitive to insulin. I experienced this first hand.

Testosterone is also induced by 3 beta HSD enzyme as well.

I want to share my experience with r andro as it is regarded as a 3 beta HSD killer by @gbolduev at least thats what i read on the ray peat forum until his posts got deleted.

I started taking it 6 days ago.
1,On the first day erections and libido increased, voice dropped.
2,But ever since the second day, libido became nonexistent, erections are 0 , hair loss 0
3,My digestion gets corrected on it, my stools are dark brown and formed, 80-90% like pre pfs.
4, after eating i feel much better with this improved digestions, eyesight is sharper. Occasionally I become more alpha, dht dominant and have better personality, it comes and goes.

All in all, apart from the lack of libido and lack of erections I conclude its putting my body into the way of recovery, reloading my deficiencies with the much better digestion and I am going to be waiting for the snap back after I go off of R andro.

I havent added the KCl and MgCl yet but i already eat a very healthy diet.
Any thoughts how I could stabilize my results after I go off the R andro? With which supplements.
I know when I go off I will have much higher libido than pre cycle as I had this similar experience with pine pollen too. It was that pre pfs type but slowly faded away and those times @gbolduev was not around either.

Anyways if we hadnt found this snap back theory i would have been much more reluctant to keep going with the r andro now because everyone seems to react to it with increased hair loss, increased erections, increased libido etc, while all of these are gone for me.

 

[wuf]

I want to share my experience with r andro as it is regarded as a 3 beta HSD killer by @gbolduev at least thats what i read on the ray peat forum until his posts got deleted.

I started taking it 6 days ago.
1,On the first day erections and libido increased, voice dropped.
2,But ever since the second day, libido became nonexistent, erections are 0 , hair loss 0
3,My digestion gets corrected on it, my stools are dark brown and formed, 80-90% like pre pfs.
4, after eating i feel much better with this improved digestions, eyesight is sharper. Occasionally I become more alpha, dht dominant and have better personality, it comes and goes.
All in all, apart from the lack of libido and lack of erections I conclude its putting my body into the way of recovery, reloading my deficiencies with the much better digestion and I am going to be waiting for the snap back after I go off of R andro.
I havent added the KCl and MgCl yet but i already eat a very healthy diet.
Any thoughts how I could stabilize my results after I go off the R andro? With which supplements.
I know when I go off I will have much higher libido than pre cycle as I had this similar experience with pine pollen too. It was that pre pfs type but slowly faded away and those times @gbolduev was not around either.
Anyways if we hadnt found this snap back theory i would have been much more reluctant to keep going with the r andro now because everyone seems to react to it with increased hair loss, increased erections, increased libido etc, while all of these are gone for me.

There is a proper thread for R andro if you are inrìterested in.
By the way, it is a long time I am very interested in R Andro. I used it just a couple of days in july and I had the same symptoms as yours, no erections, no libido etc. Then they came back.
How long are you going to run it?

 

[freeflow]

There is a proper thread for R andro if you are inrìterested.
By the way, it is a long time I am very interested in R Andro. I used it just a couple of days in july and I had the same symptoms as your, no erections, no libido etc. Then they came back.
How long are you going to run it?

I will up the dose, as im using only 2x100mg a day and will add one more evening dose. So about 15-6 days more, in total 22 days.

I think we hit the root for our case wuf, we will just need some cofactors, minerals, vitamins to keep up the libido after the r andro round. Or even during on r andro.

 

[wuf]

I will up the dose, as im using only 2x100mg a day and will add one more evening dose. So about 15-6 days more, in total 22 days.
I think we hit the root for our case wuf, we will just need some cofactors, minerals, vitamins to keep up the libido after the r andro round. Or even during on r andro.

Should ask gbold what kind of cofactor to use after dropping R Andro.
Did you take blood test like progesterone etc to understand where you at?..Just curious to see what will change in the future after R Andro.

 

[TubZy]

I want to share my experience with r andro as it is regarded as a 3 beta HSD killer by @gbolduev at least thats what i read on the ray peat forum until his posts got deleted.

I started taking it 6 days ago.
1,On the first day erections and libido increased, voice dropped.
2,But ever since the second day, libido became nonexistent, erections are 0 , hair loss 0
3,My digestion gets corrected on it, my stools are dark brown and formed, 80-90% like pre pfs.
4, after eating i feel much better with this improved digestions, eyesight is sharper. Occasionally I become more alpha, dht dominant and have better personality, it comes and goes.

All in all, apart from the lack of libido and lack of erections I conclude its putting my body into the way of recovery, reloading my deficiencies with the much better digestion and I am going to be waiting for the snap back after I go off of R andro.

I havent added the KCl and MgCl yet but i already eat a very healthy diet.
Any thoughts how I could stabilize my results after I go off the R andro? With which supplements.
I know when I go off I will have much higher libido than pre cycle as I had this similar experience with pine pollen too. It was that pre pfs type but slowly faded away and those times @gbolduev was not around either.

Anyways if we hadnt found this snap back theory i would have been much more reluctant to keep going with the r andro now because everyone seems to react to it with increased hair loss, increased erections, increased libido etc, while all of these are gone for me.

When you add in electrolytes let us know. I'm curious to see how you feel. A long time ago I ran R Andri initially and I felt great on it. Then I got off and tried it again a few months later and didn't get the same effect anymore. This was years ago, so haven't really tried it since then.

 

[freeflow]

When you add in electrolytes let us know. I'm curious to see how you feel. A long time ago I ran R Andri initially and I felt great on it. Then I got off and tried it again a few months later and didn't get the same effect anymore. This was years ago, so haven't really tried it since then.

Interestingly I had this same effect from pine pollen in 2017 summer, fatigue, no erections and so on. And as time went on I started to have a different reactoion to pine pollen, some increased muscles, anger and better personality. So my reaction changed to it. But this r andro really gives me the old pine pollen feeling. Deleting my sexuality.
I had a blood test in november. Progesterone was on the low end of the scale. I had a hair test too, I had potassium way over than normal in the cell.
Checked my Na/K ratio on the ARL interpretation and I am totally in the cancer growing body chemistry state which was discussed in the very beginning on RPF when @gbolduev appeared.

Im still blown away by the experience how tribulus and r andro can turn my loose, diarrhoea like stools into formed, almost pre pfs type stools. Sorry for writing this too many times but I reckon this is a very important piece in my case.

 

[bruschi11]

Is it crazy if it seems I've been getting libido while drinking malic acid? This is my 3rd day trying it and 2nd day in a row where its happened.

 

[Admiral]

I want to share my experience with r andro as it is regarded as a 3 beta HSD killer by @gbolduev at least thats what i read on the ray peat forum until his posts got deleted.

I started taking it 6 days ago.
1,On the first day erections and libido increased, voice dropped.
2,But ever since the second day, libido became nonexistent, erections are 0 , hair loss 0
3,My digestion gets corrected on it, my stools are dark brown and formed, 80-90% like pre pfs.
4, after eating i feel much better with this improved digestions, eyesight is sharper. Occasionally I become more alpha, dht dominant and have better personality, it comes and goes.

All in all, apart from the lack of libido and lack of erections I conclude its putting my body into the way of recovery, reloading my deficiencies with the much better digestion and I am going to be waiting for the snap back after I go off of R andro.

I havent added the KCl and MgCl yet but i already eat a very healthy diet.
Any thoughts how I could stabilize my results after I go off the R andro? With which supplements.
I know when I go off I will have much higher libido than pre cycle as I had this similar experience with pine pollen too. It was that pre pfs type but slowly faded away and those times @gbolduev was not around either.

Anyways if we hadnt found this snap back theory i would have been much more reluctant to keep going with the r andro now because everyone seems to react to it with increased hair loss, increased erections, increased libido etc, while all of these are gone for me.

What about estrogen? Seems like most get greater benefits when they take it with inositol or resveratrol. I’m looking for something simular. Stanazolol did a lot of good things for me some years ago, but nothing on the sexual parts.

 

[TubZy]

Interestingly I had this same effect from pine pollen in 2017 summer, fatigue, no erections and so on. And as time went on I started to have a different reactoion to pine pollen, some increased muscles, anger and better personality. So my reaction changed to it. But this r andro really gives me the old pine pollen feeling. Deleting my sexuality.
I had a blood test in november. Progesterone was on the low end of the scale. I had a hair test too, I had potassium way over than normal in the cell.
Checked my Na/K ratio on the ARL interpretation and I am totally in the cancer growing body chemistry state which was discussed in the very beginning on RPF when @gbolduev appeared.

Im still blown away by the experience how tribulus and r andro can turn my loose, diarrhoea like stools into formed, almost pre pfs type stools. Sorry for writing this too many times but I reckon this is a very important piece in my case.

Hmm..how do you feel when you tank potassium? Have you tried taking something that tanks potassium with potassium and see how you feel since you have high potassium in the cell? R Andro is odd, I have seen like so many different responses to it. Same with pine pollen, it increased my libido but I felt very weird on it like bad anxiety and increased in brain fog so I stopped that long long ago. For me using hormones is always more tricky to nail down.

 

[freeflow]

Hmm..how do you feel when you tank potassium? Have you tried taking something that tanks potassium with potassium and see how you feel since you have high potassium in the cell? R Andro is odd, I have seen like so many different responses to it. Same with pine pollen, it increased my libido but I felt very weird on it like bad anxiety and increased in brain fog so I stopped that long long ago. For me using hormones is always more tricky to nail down.

I tried copper with potassium. I havent experimented enough days to give a clear conclusion, but:
I have low copper on the hair test.
When i use it my tinnitus goes way lower, and music starts playing in my head, very very good feeling.
Without potassium my body temperature crashes the next day, just like after thorne extra.

I think i was a slow oxidizer thats why i developed aga at age 17-18, but i was doing sports all my life hence the low copper i guess.

Its clearly a mineral and electrolyte imbalance for me, took some multivitamins when i was one month into pfs and woken up cured. Then orgasm crashed me.

Now the plan is to fill up my electrolyte and mineral reserves while i have good digestion on r andro, and see what happens when i come off.
My case could easily be cured with proper mineral balancing protocoll if i knew how to do it.

 

[freeflow]

What about estrogen? Seems like most get greater benefits when they take it with inositol or resveratrol. I’m looking for something simular. Stanazolol did a lot of good things for me some years ago, but nothing on the sexual parts.

Havent tried adding resveratrol, if i decide to do it id add resveratrol, copper and electrolytes. We will see, still have 16 days on r andro but i expect the bigger switch after coming off.

 

[mattyb]

How do you digest properly when you are off HCl? Do you take something else?

If you go off HCl and your digestion isn't normal, it means the underlying problem isn't fixed.

Try taking HCl with the proper chloride electrolytes (KCl, MgCl, NaCl), then follow up with amino acid supplementation, and see what happens then.

 

[Helen]

Is it crazy if it seems I've been getting libido while drinking malic acid? This is my 3rd day trying it and 2nd day in a row where its happened.

No., that is why I told you to take malic acid. NAPDH is formed in 3 places in Krebs cycle. Remember my post. that is why Isaid if you give malic, isocitrate it will give you libido. try NADH

 

[bruschi11]

No., that is why I told you to take malic acid. NAPDH is formed in 3 places in Krebs cycle. Remember my post. that is why Isaid if you give malic, isocitrate it will give you libido. try NADH

Purchased- will be in hand on Super Bowl Sunday. Tommy and I both will be having great days!

 

[Helen]

Purchased- will be in hand on Super Bowl Sunday. Tommy and I both will be having great days!

Malic acid always made me young. That is why if you do lots of liver flushes that you have to . You will be drinking a lot of malic. ACV is nothing comparing to malic.

Fasting , breuss protocol, liver flushes, plus HCl with aminos electrolytes all that is mentioned in the protocol, should keep your

1) protein synthesis good
2) sensitive hormones
3) systemic proteins working
4) glutathione and Sods working
5) liver flushes will have your fat soluble vitamins absorbtion online. Dont take those. I dont rec to take fat soluble ones. I found that they stop bile flow.

 

[PAS]

Sir will the advice given by you here and throughout the forum work for PAS victims? The general improvement of life tips will do but I am curious about your PFS treatment advice

 

[PFStinks]

People are recommending the HCL versions but I've got good results from just supplement versions.
Im using:
Triple Magnesium Complex 400mg
Potassium Gluconate 595mg (Only 99mg of potassium so I add Tomato juice for extra potassium)
NAC 600mg
Copper 2mg

If its not supposed to work maybe I'm just getting a placebo??

 

[TubZy]

People are recommending the HCL versions but I've got good results from just supplement versions.
Im using:
Triple Magnesium Complex 400mg
Potassium Gluconate 595mg (Only 99mg of potassium so I add Tomato juice for extra potassium)
NAC 600mg
Copper 2mg

If its not supposed to work maybe I'm just getting a placebo??

No, you are good I know a few other ppl that used NAC with results as well. No histidine though?

 

[PFStinks]

No, you are good I know a few other ppl that used NAC with results as well. No histidine though?

Nope, since Scenes wasnt using any histidine originally and he recovered - I thought I'd try just Cysteine.