Im unable to sleep

Cdsnuts

Cdsnuts

Moderator
Messages
114
Shadow said:
Im using calcium, magnesium and passiflora incarnata, I can fall asleep, but I wake up multiple times, adding all this "sleep" moments, I think I could say that Im sleeping 1-2 hours, feels like a train runned over me. I ordered some new things including phophatidylserin, I it helps more...

And yes, It is hard when people dont believe in us... Im currently deprived of all the things that I liked, I can feel when you said that you lost everthing.
Click to expand...

Have you tried high dose glycine? I've had a few guys tell me they've used 15-20 grams in one shot and slept like a rock. I've tried it as well after a bender of a weekend. I personally used 12 grams and I not only slept well, I woke up feeling refreshed.

Glycine | Total Male Optimization

I'm actually going to rewrite this page to include the higher dosing amounts.

You can also get it at most supplement shops, vitamin shoppe, GNC, etc.

Do some research on it. I've read plenty of links of people safely using up to 60 grams.

I know what it's like to be in that state, and it's absolute torture. You've got nothing to lose. Try it and let me know how you get on.
 
Shadow

Shadow

Moderator
Messages
383
Cdsnuts said:
Have you tried high dose glycine? I've had a few guys tell me they've used 15-20 grams in one shot and slept like a rock. I've tried it as well after a bender of a weekend. I personally used 12 grams and I not only slept well, I woke up feeling refreshed.

Glycine | Total Male Optimization

I'm actually going to rewrite this page to include the higher dosing amounts.

You can also get it at most supplement shops, vitamin shoppe, GNC, etc.

Do some research on it. I've read plenty of links of people safely using up to 60 grams.

I know what it's like to be in that state, and it's absolute torture. You've got nothing to lose. Try it and let me know how you get on.
Click to expand...


I will give it a try, but supplements here in my country are a pain in the ass to find...

UPDATE:
After 4 days in the sittuation that I described, I started to regain the ability do sleep and the jolt feeling disappeared. I was able to sleep for 5 - 6h / night.
I was using:
- Magnesium Bisglicinate 400mg 3x/day
- L-Theanine 200mg 2x/day
- Phosphatidylserine 200mg 2x/day
- Oleamide 50mg / day

It was all fine until yesterday.

Started to feel the classical (butterflies in the stomach) anxiety feeling, a little bit of tremor, feeling cold. And them again, lost the ability to sleep and feel tired, but this time with no jolt on the just, just the "butterfly" feeling, which is equaly terrible. Lost apetite, some loose stool.

I hope that it subsides soon but at this time with no added worsenings or symptoms.


Im sick of this country... is hard to do anything her... getting a hair test, supplements, vitamins...


More info:

Both times the issue started with:
- "butterflies in the stomach" feeling
- tremors and twitches
- feeling cold
- no more sleep
- an itchy feeling in my spine(akatisia?)
The first time I got worsening in trigeminal pain, I could feel the nerves inside my teeths, tinnitus, restless leg, pain in nerves.

The first time my condition worsened:
- Skin more numb(better, but still baseline)
- Genital more numb(better, a little worse than baseline)
- Worse ED(better, still baseline)
- Anehdonia/Anxiety butterlies(worse than baseline)
- Pain in trigeminal nerve terminations in gums(better)

Some improved for a little time:
- Less intrusive Tinnitus(returned to baseline)
- Less restless leg feeling(hard to tell)
- My hives vanished for some time(again this second time)

@Area-1255 I did the blood tests that you suggested, all normal.

Overall this time looks less severe than the first(but I still cant sleep), lets see if it will worsen or resolve faster.

Oh, some strange thing, both times, while trying to sleep, I could imagine things clearly in my mind, very, go figure... And before that new crash some symptoms like anhendonia, anxiety feeling, arousal became a little better.
 
Last edited:
Cdsnuts

Cdsnuts

Moderator
Messages
114
Shadow said:
I will give it a try, but supplements here in my country are a pain in the ass to find...

UPDATE:
After 4 days in the sittuation that I described, I started to regain the ability do sleep and the jolt feeling disappeared. I was able to sleep for 5 - 6h / night.
I was using:
- Magnesium Bisglicinate 400mg 3x/day
- L-Theanine 200mg 2x/day
- Phosphatidylserine 200mg 2x/day
- Oleamide 50mg / day

It was all fine until yesterday.

Started to feel the classical (butterflies in the stomach) anxiety feeling, a little bit of tremor, feeling cold. And them again, lost the ability to sleep and feel tired, but this time with no jolt on the just, just the "butterfly" feeling, which is equaly terrible. Lost apetite, some loose stool.

I hope that it subsides soon but at this time with no added worsenings or symptoms.


Im sick of this country... is hard to do anything her... getting a hair test, supplements, vitamins...


More info:

Both times the issue started with:
- "butterflies in the stomach" feeling
- tremors and twitches
- feeling cold
- no more sleep
- an itchy feeling in my spine(akatisia?)
The first time I got worsening in trigeminal pain, I could feel the nerves inside my teeths, tinnitus, restless leg, pain in nerves.

The first time my condition worsened:
- Skin more numb(better, but still baseline)
- Genital more numb(better, a little worse than baseline)
- Worse ED(better, still baseline)
- Anehdonia/Anxiety butterlies(worse than baseline)
- Pain in trigeminal nerve terminations in gums(better)

Some improved for a little time:
- Less intrusive Tinnitus(returned to baseline)
- Less restless leg feeling(hard to tell)
- My hives vanished for some time(again this second time)

@Area-1255 I did the blood tests that you suggested, all normal.

Overall this time looks less severe than the first(but I still cant sleep), lets see if it will worsen or resolve faster.

Oh, some strange thing, both times, while trying to sleep, I could imagine things clearly in my mind, very, go figure... And before that new crash some symptoms like anhendonia, anxiety feeling, arousal became a little better.
Click to expand...

Have you tried Albizia? Albizia | Total Male Optimization

You have to dose it around two tablespoons, and it taste pretty rough, but herbwise, this one works the best out of all of them for sleep.

You can also safely combine it with the other things on your current list such as magnesium, Ziziphus, etc.

You can also dose the glycine pretty high. I've read accounts of guys taking up to 60 grams (they were mental patients) This is obviously not cost effective, but the point I'm making is that you can dose it much, much higher than recommended and it's still safe.

This is one area where I always threw caution to the wind when I was healing. We all know how torturous going with out sleep regularly can be. There were times when I would get so desperate, I would do and take anything for a nights rest.
 
Shadow

Shadow

Moderator
Messages
383
@Cdsnuts

The first night I wasnt able to sleep, tried some Albizia(I think that I took too little ).

But my body was able to recover much faster this time, I was awake for 36h only this time. Albizia + Ziziphus + Oleamide made my sleep better! I can sleep like, 6h - 7h.

I wish I knew about this natural things before... well I cant fully blame myself, I trusted and MD with PhD that SSRIs were harmless and safe... gosh how they trust so blindly this things and big pharma claims... ffs, ssris have the same efficacy as a placebo! And even worse, how they took as absolute truth the freaking monoamine HYPOTHESIS! I want so bad to book an appoitment and beat the shit out of that egomaniac dr...

I cant understand this problem, why things appears, disappear and change so frenquently... I wonder, are the things getting worse or just the body trying to reach homeostasis?
 
N

noprop

Well-Known Member
Messages
499
Shadow said:
@Cdsnuts

The first night I wasnt able to sleep, tried some Albizia(I think that I took too little ).

But my body was able to recover much faster this time, I was awake for 36h only this time. Albizia + Ziziphus + Oleamide made my sleep better! I can sleep like, 6h - 7h.

I wish I knew about this natural things before... well I cant fully blame myself, I trusted and MD with PhD that SSRIs were harmless and safe... gosh how they trust so blindly this things and big pharma claims... ffs, ssris have the same efficacy as a placebo! And even worse, how they took as absolute truth the freaking monoamine HYPOTHESIS! I want so bad to book an appoitment and beat the shit out of that egomaniac dr...

I cant understand this problem, why things appears, disappear and change so frenquently... I wonder, are the things getting worse or just the body trying to reach homeostasis?
Click to expand...

Yeah, some docs believe the shit learned at uni. Some are f..liars cause they get money by prescribing that BS.
 
Cdsnuts

Cdsnuts

Moderator
Messages
114
Shadow said:
@Cdsnuts

The first night I wasnt able to sleep, tried some Albizia(I think that I took too little ).

But my body was able to recover much faster this time, I was awake for 36h only this time. Albizia + Ziziphus + Oleamide made my sleep better! I can sleep like, 6h - 7h.

I wish I knew about this natural things before... well I cant fully blame myself, I trusted and MD with PhD that SSRIs were harmless and safe... gosh how they trust so blindly this things and big pharma claims... ffs, ssris have the same efficacy as a placebo! And even worse, how they took as absolute truth the freaking monoamine HYPOTHESIS! I want so bad to book an appoitment and beat the shit out of that egomaniac dr...

I cant understand this problem, why things appears, disappear and change so frenquently... I wonder, are the things getting worse or just the body trying to reach homeostasis?
Click to expand...

We ALL feel your frustration and anger. Believe me. But the best use of your energy is in neither of those things. The past is done.....it happened. You have NOW....the present to be thankful, fix it, and become a better version of yourself in the process.

The changes you feel, which can be a source of great frustration, are the bodies way at healing. Everything goes in cycles.....Earth, moon, spring, summer, fall, day, night.....etc. This is why I speak of upswings and downswings. You're going to be up for a little while, feel great and then regress a bit. As long as you're following the protocol EXACTLY how it was written, this back and forth dance of three steps forward, one or two steps back, continues in an UPWARD trend of healing. Your days "up" will start getting longer and longer and consequently, your downswings are going to start getting shorter and shorter, until one day you realize that you haven't felt like shit in weeks!

Health builds. It builds in a way that is easy to be felt once you start getting more and more connected to your body and more importantly, your mind.

For some guys they can get there in six months, for others, it takes years. But it none the less they get there. Fact.

That's a nice stack. How high were you dosing the Al? You could up the dose of the Ablizia for some more effects. When I was taking it, I was taking two HEAPING Tablespoons of it. It has a very weird after taste but the effects are worth it.
 
Last edited:
L

leosp

Messages
2
I take magnesium bisglycinate at night to calm anxiety and relax before sleep. I will also add ziziphus
 
barbaar

barbaar

Well-Known Member
Messages
807
Orion said:
@barbaar this is just baking soda in boiling water, what does this do? thanks
Click to expand...

Yesterday Helen mentioned in my log that the 'shock' feeling when you try to fall asleep could be caused by respiratory acidosis, the body can't relax and when your breathing drive gets lowered when falling asleep your body basically releases a huge adrenaline spike to wake you up and start breathing more.

I don't fully understand the mechanisms behind it but I'm assuming the sodium bicarb is supposed to counter the respiratory acidosis, maybe increase breathing drive a little so you can fall asleep without your body thinking you're suffocating and waking you up.
 
Orion

Orion

Well-Known Member
Messages
879
barbaar said:
Yesterday Helen mentioned in my log that the 'shock' feeling when you try to fall asleep could be caused by respiratory acidosis, the body can't relax and when your breathing drive gets lowered when falling asleep your body basically releases a huge adrenaline spike to wake you up and start breathing more.

I don't fully understand the mechanisms behind it but I'm assuming the sodium bicarb is supposed to counter the respiratory acidosis, maybe increase breathing drive a little so you can fall asleep without your body thinking you're suffocating and waking you up.
Click to expand...

I don't get full shock wake ups, but I always wake 2 or 3 times during the night then fall back asleep (every 3-4hrs), its one of my last symptoms I would like to clear.

Any idea on dosages and timing? this sounds like something I should experiment with.
 
barbaar

barbaar

Well-Known Member
Messages
807
Orion said:
I don't get full shock wake ups, but I always wake 2 or 3 times during the night then fall back asleep (every 3-4hrs), its one of my last symptoms I would like to clear.

Any idea on dosages and timing? this sounds like something I should experiment with.
Click to expand...

I don't know if it will help with that, do you feel like you wake up because you aren't breathing?

I haven't seen anyone try this yet on the forum so no idea about the dosages nor the timing.

You could try something like this Sodium Bicarbonate (Oral Route, Intravenous Route, Subcutaneous Route) Proper Use - Mayo Clinic before bed I guess?

Might want to ask @Helen first if it's ok since it might be a bad idea to be messing with your pH just like that, but I guess trying it once or twice wouldn't hurt you too much

A more well tested option would be the @Cdsnuts sleep stack, I think @Shadow is giving that a shot now.
 
Orion

Orion

Well-Known Member
Messages
879
barbaar said:
I don't know if it will help with that, do you feel like you wake up because you aren't breathing?
Click to expand...

Not sure what it is, just assuming its low breathing, since my nostrils usually always plug up and guess I snore, so low oxygen intake.

Tried all the peaty things, and making great improvements from this forum, just can't sleep 7-8hrs straight.

I will wait until after this next hairtest cycle and see where I stand, you are correct messing with pH doesn't sound like a good idea.
 
C

Concerned

Well-Known Member
Messages
159
Niles said:
In the short term, phosphatidylserine and oleamide are the two best things I found for sleep that won't hurt you in the long run like harder options (benzos, barbiturates, etc)
Click to expand...

Niles said:
Sure thing. Read up on these a bit before going the benzo route, because it sounds like your insomnia is really similar to what mine was. Another thing that helped me to a degree was ziziphus, from @Cdsnuts protocol. The albizia didn't do much for me sleep-wise, though. I stacked ziziphus, oleamide, phosphatidylserine, magnesium, and l-theanine on some of my worst nights and it usually had me asleep within 30ish minutes.
Click to expand...

Cdsnuts said:
Ziziphus | Total Male Optimization
Click to expand...

Cdsnuts said:
Glycine | Total Male Optimization
Click to expand...

Is there a decent UK or even EU source anyone for phosphatidylserine, oleamide, ziziphus or albizia? Not a lot on amazon for those here in the UK.

I can get to sleep easily but wake up every hour or every other hour. This pfs sleep isn't proper sleep really.

I've managed to find this for magnesium: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Your-Suppl...528918834&sr=1-4&keywords=magnesium+glycinate

and this for glycine: https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00MW10ASW/ref=ox_sc_act_title_4?smid=A2USH43P966G34&psc=1

Hope they're decent enough supplements to get a full night's sleep.
 
Ingeno

Ingeno

Well-Known Member
Messages
404
Concerned said:
Is there a decent UK or even EU source anyone for phosphatidylserine, oleamide, ziziphus or albizia? Not a lot on amazon for those here in the UK.

I can get to sleep easily but wake up every hour or every other hour. This pfs sleep isn't proper sleep really.

I've managed to find this for magnesium: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Your-Suppl...528918834&sr=1-4&keywords=magnesium+glycinate

and this for glycine: https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00MW10ASW/ref=ox_sc_act_title_4?smid=A2USH43P966G34&psc=1

Hope they're decent enough supplements to get a full night's sleep.
Click to expand...

Phosphatidyl Serine Tablets 100mg
 
Shadow

Shadow

Moderator
Messages
383
@Concerned you are lucky to live in EU, here where I live, I need to import(when possible) the supplements/herb/whatever, and pay much much more for it =/
 
You must log in or register to reply here.