Copper

Admiral

Well-Known Member
Messages
959
Aside from the sexual problems, my main problems are all copper related. I feel if I can fix my copper imbalance, I can live through this. I'm currently trying to get another hair test done, but I feel the program doesn't read or fight a copper imbalance properly and fast enough. If I were to fight this problem, I just don't know where to start as I have no clue whether I am copper toxic, copper deficient or have biounavailabe copper. Dr Wilson has a nice article about it but nor he seems very clear. He just preaches a full program will handle this over time (COPPER TOXICITY SYNDROME). My main symptoms are described just perfectly in that piece.

Some of the copper imbalance signs I've experienced:
  • Low ceruloplasmin
  • No connective tissue
  • Bone loss
  • Collagen loss
  • Systematic candida overgrowth
  • Brittle and weak hair
  • Vitiligo
  • No pigment repair
  • Yellow color in the corner of my eyes
Normal serum copper and zinc levels but low copper on the hair test. It seemed as it it dropped even further the more copper I took.

If I can cure this, I would be the happiest person alive. Not sure the R-Andro cycles I had planned will work for this.

Any experiences or suggestions?
 
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freeflow

Well-Known Member
Messages
302
If i were you, I would do a long water fast on salt and potassium and test the hair which grows during the fast. I did this and the 3 amigos (Iron, aluminium, manganese) were coming out nicely. Dr. Wilson says these always come together, if you are toxic in 1 or 2, you probably have the 3rd too. It was true in my case.
Shine some infrared lamp on the liver too during the fast, if you have copper in there, it will come.

The fast was very drastic and depleting in my case, i find the nutritional balancing with other therapies are gentler and more bearable. I felt shit after the a fast for long time, like depleted, couldnt even eat a a banana withoug gyno coming and panic.
 

supernature

Member
Messages
921
I have no clue whether I am copper toxic, copper deficient or have biounavailabe copper.


Are you speaking hair copper around 1 and below ? Thats some hard to tell what is it exactly, had same copper values on mine and i think its common picture seen on hair tests and probably the most twisted topic so far: is it low, is it toxic or is it not bioavailable.
Have you tried hardcore copper antagonists like molybdenum to see if you have enough copper actually ?
 

Admiral

Well-Known Member
Messages
959
If i were you, I would do a long water fast on salt and potassium and test the hair which grows during the fast. I did this and the 3 amigos (Iron, aluminium, manganese) were coming out nicely. Dr. Wilson says these always come together, if you are toxic in 1 or 2, you probably have the 3rd too. It was true in my case.
Shine some infrared lamp on the liver too during the fast, if you have copper in there, it will come.

The fast was very drastic and depleting in my case, i find the nutritional balancing with other therapies are gentler and more bearable. I felt shit after the a fast for long time, like depleted, couldnt even eat a a banana withoug gyno coming and panic.

I already did an 8 and 21 day fast and it didn't do anything as far as symptom relief. I even experienced accelerated bone loss on fasts which never recovered. I'll never fast again

What do you think about mitosynergy ?
Maybe the one with only 0.2mg copper ?

How do you feel on high copper foods ? Have you have done something like cronometer for a week to see your daily copper intake ?

I find it hard to focus on any plan to fight copper as I don't know my exact situation. I took 8mg of copper for a stretch of two months and I didn't notice any benefits. In fact, my copper and ceruloplasmin dropped even further. I could try mitosynergy someday.

Are you speaking hair copper around 1 and below ? Thats some hard to tell what is it exactly, had same copper values on mine and i think its common picture seen on hair tests and probably the most twisted topic so far: is it low, is it toxic or is it not bioavailable.
Have you tried hardcore copper antagonists like molybdenum to see if you have enough copper actually ?

I think a lot of us are helped so much if we were to get a clearer picture on copper.
I have tried periods of molybdenum in the past, but again, I never pulled through as I don't know exactly what I am doing.
 

RebelWithACause

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,712
For me copper is improving me a lot. Libido and personality. I did 4months with pretty high zinc before that. I have to go another 1,25 months ill make an update then
 

manu

Well-Known Member
Messages
213
I think one thing you could try is heavy metal chelation.
If there is an estrogen mimic in your system (like mercury) body thinks you already have too much copper.
So it won't increase regardless of how much you take...

But I'm sure there are many other possibilities...

Do you have some grey hairs?
 

supernature

Member
Messages
921
I think neither Wilson, nor ARL or TEI know for sure how to deal with the copper deal. MT had been discontinued from public testing many years ago and now go figure what exactly is going on, thats why so much speculations on that topic.
 

Admiral

Well-Known Member
Messages
959
I think one thing you could try is heavy metal chelation.
If there is an estrogen mimic in your system (like mercury) body thinks you already have too much copper.
So it won't increase regardless of how much you take...

But I'm sure there are many other possibilities...

Do you have some grey hairs?

Estrogen is very low, though.
I have some white hairs in my beard. None on my head that I know of.
 

Helen

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Messages
5,415
I think neither Wilson, nor ARL or TEI know for sure how to deal with the copper deal. MT had been discontinued from public testing many years ago and now go figure what exactly is going on, thats why so much speculations on that topic.

Wilson has no clue , he is not a creator of any programs or biochemist

TEI and ARL tested this in and out and all the information which is online stems from Eck. All this biounavailable copper stuff etc, came from TEI and ARL.

ALL OF IT


This is why some people need to be fed tons of zinc first, before they give them copper,

and some people need to be fed tons of copper first before they give zinc.

and the improvement will happen only when they feed the second mineral

meaning if you are deficient in both copper and zinc , but toxic in copper in the brain, they will feed you zinc, which will make you feel like total shit

and then copper will go down in the brain, and will be allowed to go into tissue, thus then the feed copper and boom you are good.


Same with high iron people. first they give them copper, this lowers iron

and then they will turn around and feed copper and vitamin C and zinc and copper is available in tissues, since ceruloplasmin increases IRON , and if you are iron toxic, ceruloplasmin will not go up. either


that is how I understand it.

Copper will be available in hair only when the second mineral goes up associated with it and when iron is down from the brain.


People here look at the cycle as fixing their things, this is not right, and correct.

one cycle is just one leg of may be 5-6 legs needed to get fixed and feel better.


Each leg of the cycle, fixes certain things and is not to make you feel better, it can actually make you feel much worse, since, they are just trying to fix one leg.

so think about the program as going thru 5-6 legs , only then you should feel something.
 
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Helen

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Messages
5,415
+1 for more information about copper. I took 3.5mg for like 2 weeks and it persistently made me much worse. Bad genital numbness and near total ED, which was never as bad before.


TEI , was not giving you copper.. you are a slow oxidizer, with high calcium , copper just increased the calcium and slowed down the oxidation rate. which decreased your estrogen thus lower libido/
 

Helen

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Messages
5,415
Aside from the sexual problems, my main problems are all copper related. I feel if I can fix my copper imbalance, I can live through this. I'm currently trying to get another hair test done, but I feel the program doesn't read or fight a copper imbalance properly and fast enough. If I were to fight this problem, I just don't know where to start as I have no clue whether I am copper toxic, copper deficient or have biounavailabe copper. Dr Wilson has a nice article about it but nor he seems very clear. He just preaches a full program will handle this over time (COPPER TOXICITY SYNDROME). My main symptoms are described just perfectly in that piece.

Some of the copper imbalance signs I've experienced:
  • Low ceruloplasmin
  • No connective tissue
  • Bone loss
  • Collagen loss
  • Systematic candida overgrowth
  • Brittle and weak hair
  • Vitiligo
  • No pigment repair
  • Yellow color in the corner of my eyes
Normal serum copper and zinc levels but low copper on the hair test. It seemed as it it dropped even further the more copper I took.

If I can cure this, I would be the happiest person alive. Not sure the R-Andro cycles I had planned will work for this.

Any experiences or suggestions?


same symptoms can happen with Iron toxicity.
 

Helen

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Messages
5,415
Look at @Goose12 they first kept feeding him anti copper things, for 2-3 cycles, hard, to raise his levels of zinc manganese, b1 etc.

and he felt awful on the cycle, if he took copper at first, he would die. and feel just terrible since his met rate would just die. totally.

this is why they chose to feed him zinc first, and raised him met rate and chelated copper from the brain,

then as zinc reserves were replenished, they started to give him copper and then when he was able to take the copper,

same happened with Rebel


other people are probably the opposite, they first give copper, and you feel like shit and at some point they will feed the second part and that is when you feel ok.


They use minerals not to substitute here, but to Chelate and use minerals like hormones, that is why these programs are not substitution program,

they can sacrifice some minerals in order to do certain things which they thing are needed to be done.

it is like a lego constructor, they are doing layer by layer, fix one layer, then next, then next, since feed everything at once would not do anything,

people get everything at once from food.




Of course the program could be not correct, or the hairtest was done not properly, I of course could assume that also.

But @supernature you don't understand how these programs work as an idea. as I told you already, they don't substitute minerals. It is not how it works.

This is my understanding of these programs, of course I could be wrong.


This is why on first cycles on first year or even the second year, depending what mineral you have which is interfering with stuff , you could feel worse, and that worse could be for a long long time,


This is why personally I USED CHELATION , to speed up this process,

since when TEI and ARL does this , they do this by pushing a bad mineral like lead, mercury , copper iron, or whatever you are talking in, by using other minerals

and it takes TIME and make you feel like shit, since they are fixing one compartment like Brain, and sacrificing another compartment tissue, heart, liver, etc in the moment.



This is why when I understood this stuff, and I knew that I head LEAD problem, i DECIDED to go chelation route.

I just used ALA plus carnitine,

and EDTA etc and that sped up all my personal things.


People with PFS are sick before finasteride, so fixing PFS is a joke, it is almost impossible to fix, since you were predisposed to it.

all the minerals imbalances, then cause all kind of stuff, like gut problems, like fungus growth, like bacterial growth, etc.

electrolytes imbalances.


This is why people fight all these for ages using all kinds of gut things, sibo antibiotics, this that, and no one cures anything really.


Unless of course the original problem was not caused by antibiotics use.

Then killing off the fungus and rebuilding the flora will fix copper metabolism

But if copper metabolism was impaired for a long time, then your brain is already toxic,

and your PH will be always disregulated by the brain, and thus all those gut workshops don't last.

you kill fungus, and it grows again, since PH is simply disregulated
 
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supernature

Member
Messages
921
But @supernature you don't understand how these programs work as an idea. as I told you already, they don't substitute minerals. It is not how it works.


That is fine, i dont understand it, thats too complex to mess around with manually, thats why there is this request of more simplistic way of addressing particular important enzymes with 1-3 minerals, vitamins, aminos or just trying combination of minerals based on some symptoms or what we think we need based on some levels , ratios from blood, hair etc values, something simpler.

This is why when I understood this stuff, and I knew that I head LEAD problem, i DECIDED to go chelation route.

I just used ALA plus carnitine,

and EDTA etc and that sped up all my personal things.


I start to think it could be this what causing pyroluria symptoms in me, also literature says it could be either lead or mercury in pyrrole, porphyria, pyroluria cases.
I remember when was little kid we used to play in the junk yard busting open dead car batteries for fun, lead cells inside, i was very good at taking stuff apart.
 

Helen

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Messages
5,415
That is fine, i dont understand it, thats too complex to mess around with manually, thats why there is this request of more simplistic way of addressing particular important enzymes with 1-3 minerals, vitamins, aminos or just trying combination of minerals based on some symptoms or what we think we need based on some levels , ratios from blood, hair etc values, something simpler.




I start to think it could be this what causing pyroluria symptoms in me, also literature says it could be either lead or mercury in pyrrole, porphyria, pyroluria cases.
I remember when was little kid we used to play in the junk yard busting open dead car batteries for fun, lead cells inside, i was very good at taking stuff apart.


exactly , lead and heavy metals, lower glutathione reductase,

that is what I told you.

I told you the simplest way also, which I did, is CHELATION.


ARL fixes the toxicities but it takes time , read what I wrote. again
 

barbaar

Well-Known Member
Messages
807
TEI , was not giving you copper.. you are a slow oxidizer, with high calcium , copper just increased the calcium and slowed down the oxidation rate. which decreased your estrogen thus lower libido/

I know, I decided to take a chance and try it together with selenium after you mentioned it. I screwed up but at least I'm 100% convinced now minerals are powerful stuff