Hair loss theory

Helen

Helen

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tallglass13 said:
Hahaha, well maybe he started late. But yes, his hair was very short, very high hairline. Again, I like Haidut, and like his work and his company. I don't like to comment on peoples appearance because I believe its un-polite and mean. However, I hope he can regrow his hair, just like i'm trying to re-grow my hair. I just assumed he had a full head of hair. He had a full beard up to his cheeks, and he looks powerful. Danny's hair is getting bigger and better every time I see him.
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Where did you see him?
 
J

JDreamer

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55
Helen said:
First, Cortisol and progesterone go opposite of each other, when one is high another should be low. Secondly cortisol and adrenaline go up when thyroid is fast. to cap thyroid body converts testosterone into estrogen and prolactin , prolactin helps to retain calcium.

So when you see high cortisol high lactic acid, high estrogen, most probably person is a fast oxidizer. Actually these people tend to have high TSH, and high t4 to t3 conversion. And people think if they have high TSH they are hypothyroid, when in reality they are hyperthyroid. And TSH is high since the body want to produce t4 hormone to make reverse t3 out of it, to slow down the metabolism.

SO if you are hypothyroid , then cortisol will be low. and estrogen or copper wont be available, since adrenaline is not needed. And this way , since testosterone does not convert much into estrogen, there is more of it available for DHT

the problem with increasing thyroid or progesterone for hairloss, that in most cases, the body cant produce adrenaline, since glutathione is down. and the body cant recycle vitamin C and E, which are needed for adrenaline production.

Thus if you take thyroid or progesterone, without being able to produce adrenaline, the whole pressure will just go on cortisol. and cortisol will eat your hairline away .

This is why many people who tried thyroid , just found themselves with less and thinner hair.

The goal for hairloss is to have more of a fat and sugar metabolism open. and leave cortisol alone. Thyroid should be also running at good speed, not fast not slow. Thyroid is always regulated by glutathione , this is why forcing thyroid with supplements makes no sense.

Potassium in the cell is retained by progesterone, the higher potassium in the cell goes , the more progesterone will convert into cortisol. Since potassium is what makes thyroid hormone sensitive in the cell. So the higher potassium in the cell, the more thyroid effect you have , the less progesterone you need and the more cortisol you need.


So hairloss is the lack of glutathione recycling mostly. could be copper toxicity. All steroids production starts with NADPH. Since body know if there is no NADPH there is no adrenaline and if there is no adrenaline, then metabolism is not allowed to run fast.


This is why many people actually find that things that kill their metabolism slows down the hairloss.

Althought if you kill metabolism too low, then you will have no digestion at all. SO hairloss will be from protein deficiency , and if you speed up too much cortisol will burn your hair for energy.


For those slow oxidizers that have perfect hair on the sides and body , but have horse shoe problem , I think this has to do with low circulation problems. And high DHT is since estrogen is simply not needed.

Those people need to increase their metabolism , and it will make more conversion into estrogen than into DHT. And this will increase Co2 production inside of the cell which will increase circulation.
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Amazing insight.

I lean towards the idea I'm a fast oxidizer based on everything you said, but I also continue to struggle with digestive issues (when I have setbacks, my hair suffers the most). I wish I could resolve the gut issues so that I didn't have to mess with supplements. I have this bizarre lower ab fat on a body that is otherwise lean/athletic for the most part. I feel tense all the time like I just can't seem to settle down and my circulation isn't the greatest. My hair has continued to slowly recede and I'm diffused up in that horse shoe region you mentioned.

Btw, I decided to give some old Danny Roddy methods a shot. For the last week I've been supplementing Magnesium, D3, and K2 (MV-4). I'm also drinking a full glass of water mixed with a tspn of Baking Soda and some ACV twice a day to try to clear out my gut. I feel like crap to be honest and all the suddenly I'm back to having unrestful sleep.

I bought some liquid Magnsesium for scalp calcification/fibrosis thinking it was the same as MagOil, but I'm not sure it's the same thing.
 
Helen

Helen

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JDreamer said:
Amazing insight.

I lean towards the idea I'm a fast oxidizer based on everything you said, but I also continue to struggle with digestive issues (when I have setbacks, my hair suffers the most). I wish I could resolve the gut issues so that I didn't have to mess with supplements. I have this bizarre lower ab fat on a body that is otherwise lean/athletic for the most part. I feel tense all the time like I just can't seem to settle down and my circulation isn't the greatest. My hair has continued to slowly recede and I'm diffused up in that horse shoe region you mentioned.

Btw, I decided to give some old Danny Roddy methods a shot. For the last week I've been supplementing Magnesium, D3, and K2 (MV-4). I'm also drinking a full glass of water mixed with a tspn of Baking Soda and some ACV twice a day to try to clear out my gut. I feel like crap to be honest and all the suddenly I'm back to having unrestful sleep.

I bought some liquid Magnsesium for scalp calcification/fibrosis thinking it was the same as MagOil, but I'm not sure it's the same thing.
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If you are fast oxidizer, no reason to supplement magnesium. Danny Roddy never had MPB in my opinion. At most he had hairloss from stress or wrong diet never seen before and after thou. So all speculation on my part. Then he went on Ray peat with calcium copper aspirin. This is all good for a fast oxidizer. Slows them down and cortisol falls. which spares the hair. This is not a MPB hairloss it is more diffuse hairloss which he experienced. Easiest to treat and to stop.

Fast oxidizers have high TSH. And I think that what confuses these people to think that they are hypothyroid. In reality they are hyperthyroid.

I bet you anything if Danny Roddy checked his ceruloplasmin he would see that cerulo would be on the high end. Slow oxidizer will never have cerulo on the high end. SO Haidut with high cerulo , probably same as Roddy are fast oxidizers. This is why they do good on calcium. And this is why they have high lactic acid etc. Since fast oxidizer has fast thyroid and not enough oxygen for that speed of the thyroid, thus lactic acid.

Slow oxidizer have slow thyroid. and there is no need for much oxygen or sugar, and thus lactic acid is lower unless they have problems in sugar metabolism , if they do they go into 4 lows since in this case even if they are slow oxidizers they produce a lot of lactic acid and lactic acid lowers their calcium and magnesium in hair.

So I think Peat Haidut Roddy are quite confused. How do you define hypo and hyperthyroid , this is the most important. TSH does not show it at all.

You need to look at Free t3. If it is high, you are not hypothyroid. Even if you have low body temperatures and feel cold, Since in hyperthyrodism , body runs on adrenaline and cortisol, and estrogen. and prolactin.


PTH rises in hyperthyrodism , since in hypothyroidism body will never need calcium. Prolactin is increased in hyperthyrodism. I hope they will finally understand this. People see high TSH and see high prolactin and think hypothyroid. I have never seen high prolactin in slow oxidizers, most fast oxidizers on hairtest seem to have high prolactin.

Always look at free t3/ If you see high Free t3, then look at TSH. If TSH is higher than 2. Look at reverse t3. If reverse t3 is high, you are hyperthyroid. Now look at ceruloplasmin if it is on the high end. this means you are low on glutamate and glycine. Glycine in this case will bind cysteine and this will lower thyroid.

This is why glycine works for sleep. You take it and you lower your thyroid, since the enzyme which converts t4 to t3 is SELENOCYSTEINE enzyme. So if you lower cysteine, you lower thyroid.

This is why glycine works for sleep, you lower thyroid and this decrease the need for adrenaline and cortisol and you fall asleep.

Magnesium increases potassium in the cell, which will increase metabolism and will ask for more adrenaline and cortisol.

Calcium lowers thyroid , this is why adrenaline and cortisol fall.

Peat and all his friends have it backwards.

Aspirin and any acid, lowers potassium in the cell and lowers cortisol. Acids lower metabolism.

this is why if you have high TSH and high free t3. If you lower your potassium in the cell, TSH will go down, since body wont need t4 hormone to make reverse t3 out of it.


I think Peat reading all these studies made association with high TSH. and hypothyrodism. I think it is wrong. and he is completely wrong. With all the things he suggests he tries to slow down fast oxidizer. I would assume it is his case. This is why many people who take thyroid find themselves with high estrogen and they are confused how can it be. Estrogen goes up to cap off thyroid, so does prolactin. Prolactin retains calcium in the body. PTH will never go up in hypothyrodism. PTH goes up in hyperthyrodism to retain calcium. Calcium decreases thyroid hormone access into the cell. thus if you are fast oxidizer and you take calcium , your lactic acid falls since calcium will stop thyroid hormone access into the cell. The speed of your metabolism slows down and you have enough oxygen to fire sugar metabolism and your lactate falls.


Funny but Pufas by thinning out the blood and increasing cell permeability actually increase the entrance of thyroid hormone into the cell. Thus they increase the stress response. I never understood why would stress response will ever increase in hypothyrodism. You are like a turtle in hypothyrodism, you burn fuel very slowly, your stress hormones are zero.

It looks like Ray Peat just applied all these principles to his body chemistry but explained them completely totally backwards. He is doing right things for his body chemistry , like avoiding Pufas which increase thyroid entrance into the cell., like slowing down thyroid with calcium , like taking glycine to bind cysteine, all the things to slow down thyroid.
 
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B

brix

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Interesting stuff @Helen. My prolactin, TSH, and Free T3 are all high. Low hair calcium.

Why does ARL suggest such high doses of magnesium for fast oxidizers?
 
Helen

Helen

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brix said:
Interesting stuff @Helen. My prolactin, TSH, and Free T3 are all high. Low hair calcium.

Why does ARL suggest such high doses of magnesium for fast oxidizers?
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They suggest very high calcium . Paramin has more calcium than magnesium.
 
Orion

Orion

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J

JDreamer

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Helen said:
@JDreamer You see, look at this study. New therapeutic strategy for amino acid medicine: glycine improves the quality of sleep. - PubMed - NCBI

You see glycine lowers body temperatures, and thus helps sleep. This is because glycine binds cysteine. And this lowers thyroid. This decreases adrenaline and cortisol, and you sleep.

This is complete opposite of what Ray Peats says.
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Well then it sounds to me like I need to ditch the Magnesium. It's clearly driving up my cortisol even more based on how agitated I've felt on it. That's been a pervasive problem to some degree and it's gotta be from my body's over-reliance on cortisol/adrenaline. The magnesium was also giving me diarrhea and a rumbling stomach.

I should start supplementing Glycine (via Gelatine?). Should I also supplement Calcium? I was worried about taking extra calcium given that I clearly have diffused thinning, which to my knowledge is a byproduct of scalp calcification. However, I've had this running theory that the spacing that's developed in my teeth over the years has been from calcium leeching.

Btw, most of my blood tests over the last 10 years have showed a TSH ranging from 2 to 3.5 and Free T3 is always at the top of the range or slightly elevated.
 
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B

Blue88

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Messages
97
Helen said:
If you are fast oxidizer, no reason to supplement magnesium. Danny Roddy never had MPB in my opinion. At most he had hairloss from stress or wrong diet never seen before and after thou. So all speculation on my part. Then he went on Ray peat with calcium copper aspirin. This is all good for a fast oxidizer. Slows them down and cortisol falls. which spares the hair. This is not a MPB hairloss it is more diffuse hairloss which he experienced. Easiest to treat and to stop.

Fast oxidizers have high TSH. And I think that what confuses these people to think that they are hypothyroid. In reality they are hyperthyroid.

I bet you anything if Danny Roddy checked his ceruloplasmin he would see that cerulo would be on the high end. Slow oxidizer will never have cerulo on the high end. SO Haidut with high cerulo , probably same as Roddy are fast oxidizers. This is why they do good on calcium. And this is why they have high lactic acid etc. Since fast oxidizer has fast thyroid and not enough oxygen for that speed of the thyroid, thus lactic acid.

Slow oxidizer have slow thyroid. and there is no need for much oxygen or sugar, and thus lactic acid is lower unless they have problems in sugar metabolism , if they do they go into 4 lows since in this case even if they are slow oxidizers they produce a lot of lactic acid and lactic acid lowers their calcium and magnesium in hair.

So I think Peat Haidut Roddy are quite confused. How do you define hypo and hyperthyroid , this is the most important. TSH does not show it at all.

You need to look at Free t3. If it is high, you are not hypothyroid. Even if you have low body temperatures and feel cold, Since in hyperthyrodism , body runs on adrenaline and cortisol, and estrogen. and prolactin.


PTH rises in hyperthyrodism , since in hypothyroidism body will never need calcium. Prolactin is increased in hyperthyrodism. I hope they will finally understand this. People see high TSH and see high prolactin and think hypothyroid. I have never seen high prolactin in slow oxidizers, most fast oxidizers on hairtest seem to have high prolactin.

Always look at free t3/ If you see high Free t3, then look at TSH. If TSH is higher than 2. Look at reverse t3. If reverse t3 is high, you are hyperthyroid. Now look at ceruloplasmin if it is on the high end. this means you are low on glutamate and glycine. Glycine in this case will bind cysteine and this will lower thyroid.

This is why glycine works for sleep. You take it and you lower your thyroid, since the enzyme which converts t4 to t3 is SELENOCYSTEINE enzyme. So if you lower cysteine, you lower thyroid.

This is why glycine works for sleep, you lower thyroid and this decrease the need for adrenaline and cortisol and you fall asleep.

Magnesium increases potassium in the cell, which will increase metabolism and will ask for more adrenaline and cortisol.

Calcium lowers thyroid , this is why adrenaline and cortisol fall.

Peat and all his friends have it backwards.

Aspirin and any acid, lowers potassium in the cell and lowers cortisol. Acids lower metabolism.

this is why if you have high TSH and high free t3. If you lower your potassium in the cell, TSH will go down, since body wont need t4 hormone to make reverse t3 out of it.


I think Peat reading all these studies made association with high TSH. and hypothyrodism. I think it is wrong. and he is completely wrong. With all the things he suggests he tries to slow down fast oxidizer. I would assume it is his case. This is why many people who take thyroid find themselves with high estrogen and they are confused how can it be. Estrogen goes up to cap off thyroid, so does prolactin. Prolactin retains calcium in the body. PTH will never go up in hypothyrodism. PTH goes up in hyperthyrodism to retain calcium. Calcium decreases thyroid hormone access into the cell. thus if you are fast oxidizer and you take calcium , your lactic acid falls since calcium will stop thyroid hormone access into the cell. The speed of your metabolism slows down and you have enough oxygen to fire sugar metabolism and your lactate falls.


Funny but Pufas by thinning out the blood and increasing cell permeability actually increase the entrance of thyroid hormone into the cell. Thus they increase the stress response. I never understood why would stress response will ever increase in hypothyrodism. You are like a turtle in hypothyrodism, you burn fuel very slowly, your stress hormones are zero.

It looks like Ray Peat just applied all these principles to his body chemistry but explained them completely totally backwards. He is doing right things for his body chemistry , like avoiding Pufas which increase thyroid entrance into the cell., like slowing down thyroid with calcium , like taking glycine to bind cysteine, all the things to slow down thyroid.
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@Helen - are you able to outline this process for a slow oxidiser as well?
 
T

Troy

Well-Known Member
Messages
272
Helen said:
No idea. you need to test free t3, free t4 tsh and reverse t3
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Do you have any protocols to fix the traditional mpb or are there none at the moment as it’s not good to be taking supplements every day?

For example, would doing the electrolyte protocol every day be good for hairloss and is it something we can take every day without causing issues from supplementation?
 
J

JDreamer

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Messages
55
So have seenm mentioned over at a few other sites that elevated TSH with elevated FT3 often indicates a non-malignant tumor of the pituitary gland.
 
Aleksandr

Aleksandr

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1,285
tallglass13 said:
Hahaha, well maybe he started late. But yes, his hair was very short, very high hairline. Again, I like Haidut, and like his work and his company. I don't like to comment on peoples appearance because I believe its un-polite and mean. However, I hope he can regrow his hair, just like i'm trying to re-grow my hair. I just assumed he had a full head of hair. He had a full beard up to his cheeks, and he looks powerful. Danny's hair is getting bigger and better every time I see him.
Click to expand...
did u meet him in person? or a photo? wheres the photo?
 
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