Reverse penile fibrosis and testicular shrinkage

[joekool]

That answers everything and then some! Thank you for putting all that together @Orion !

 

[IHateFin]

Do you find that after every cycle you return to a slightly higher baseline with PFS? Are you overall close to being cured or still far away?

i definitly get better baseline everytime, but its not an even or overall baseline increase.
for instance after my first cycle the following raised above baseline:
- Libido
- personality
- gym pumps
- vascularity
- mood
-fat disbursement
-morning wood
-aggression
- orgasms
-sensativity
-androgen sensativity

items completely reversed:
- the love for the gym

2nd cycle baseline rose in following areas:
-gym pumps
-muscle fullness
-vascularity
- a tad libido
- a tad aggression
- ejaculate force
-ejaculate volume
-androgen sensativity

items completely reversed
-anything to do with strength
-muscle mass better than prefin
- vascularity
- fat disbursement
-dick sensativity

items that didnt further increase
-personality
-hairloss
-morning wood

so not every single item rose further above baseline as some items were touched better than others or not at all. i also take my stuff with lcarnatine which helps upregulate androgen receptor densities according to many studies.

 

[hopeforrecovery]

Here are the mattyb and gbolduev recs for breaking a very long fast and diet for slow oxidizing after re-feed:





I broke the fast following the protocol listed out by mattyb, and used the lemon egg soup recommended by gbolduev. I used one egg on day 1, two eggs on day 2, added an egg until was at 4 eggs per day on day 4.

Soupa Avgolemono Egg-Lemon Soup) Recipe - Genius Kitchen I put tons of leafy greens and veggies in the soup and used a hand held blender to make it thick soup.


Mattyb breaking fast protocol:

Days 1-7
Focus on mineral intake, particularly magnesium, sodium and potassium
Calories will still be low at this point, you'll likely regain some water weight but continue to lose fat
Vegetable broths, soups, well cooked vegetables, cooked leafy greens, etc.
Maybe some rice
Minimal herbs/spices
A bit of fats (eggs, butter) mixed in with the soups
Not very much protein, if any
Introduce food/calories slowly

Days 7-21
Anything from days 1-7 would be fine
Calorie intake will be slightly low, trending towards maintenance near the third week
Fresh vegetables and greens marinated in olive oil/vinegar
Some herbs/spices
More rice, maybe some well-cooked oats, small amounts of fruit, possibly small amounts of tubers
Small amounts of well cooked meat/seafood daily (slow roasted would be a good option)
Increase fat and protein gradually to get pancreas and gallbladder up to speed over these two weeks.

Days 21+
Everything from before is fine
Calories should be around maintenance near this point
By this point you should be able to exercise easily
More fruit, more carbohydrates (according to activity levels)
More foods high in manganese (oats, cereals, etc.) if well tolerated
More meat (and/or supplement zinc)
Tubers could be introduced if well tolerated
Should be hitting near the RDA of most vitamins/minerals by this point, with maybe the exception of calcium and vitamins e/d.

If digestion is robust at this point you can likely eat whatever your intuition is pushing you towards

High chloride greens - spinach, chard, beet greens, dandelion greens, and pea shoots are my go to. Sometimes I will mix in more mild greens like butterhead and romaine lettuces. Typically, the more bitter the better. I would sometimes even add salt to the salad for additional chloride.



Roughly following the gbolduev diet protocol after the re-feed, I think this is for slow oxidizers:

30% carbs, 50% protein, 20% fat. Vary this by increasing carbs with physical activity
Good carbs= rice
Good protein= sea food in form of shrimp, oysters, mussels, octopus, nonfat fish, tuna is ok.
Plenty of vegetables (like Kale, spinach, etc.) PUT HEAVY ACCENT ON SPINACH AND KALE and try to eat it with every meal.
Some fruit, not much. Apples, nectarines, all kinds of fruits that you like.
Milk wise, I recommend almond milk for calcium.
Once a year, 20-day fast Breuss style, you can use juice Breuss all this time.

Thank you for that!
I will follow this protocol!

Best regards!

 

[hopeforrecovery]

GHKCU could be worth a try too

https://www.hindawi.com/journals/bmri/2015/648108/

Thanks for this information, sounds interesting!
But does this GHKCU need to be injected or a products like this ok?:

https://www.amazon.com/Copper-Peptide-GHK-Cu-Skin-Hyaluronic/dp/B019DN8RQS

Best regards!

 

[joekool]

Any updates?? GHKcu is an injection...

How is everyone here?

 

[hopeforrecovery]

Hello guys! Yesterday i started to eat again so I finished my fasting. I followed Orion's protocol and I added also different supplements for my PFS. For now sadly 0 improvement. I just woke up this morning with a 30% erections like everyday, which can't really be called erection.
But I've made a lifestyle change and I'm following a type of cdnuts protocol. I know that i will not find a cure for my PFS but I have hope that my shrinkage can be reversed, which is still the worst symptom. Not having a working cock is an issue, but not having a working cock and losing it its the worst thing ever. But i don't wanna repeat me all the time, so let's stay rational.
Ive read promising Storys about reversing that penile scarring with evening primrose oil and l-carnitine!
Has anyone experience with this and if yes can I take these 2 supplements together or should I try one for a while and than the other?

Best regards!

 

[eskimojoe]

daily cialis, time,and positive thinking are your best weapons here

 

[joekool]

Well I share in the disappointment of zero benefits... I'm very shocked because it's been a 100% 'some' benefit to everyone who's fasted...

The evening primrose oil applied to penis will not hurt, and I take 1800mgs of Alpha-lipoic acid & 4000mg Acetyl L-Carnintine a day as it's supposed to help ED and repair nerves. Though this takes months so it's a time investment. (Split dosage into 2)

I now say move to R-Andro, the pro hormone to DHT. This will help bring up your androgens and improve a lot including any depression...

Cialis will help too, nightly between 2.5mg & 5mg... no more... you can go every other day too to save money. This will restore some nighttime erections and get blood flow going, reversing some atrophy you experienced.

Man, I'm so disappointed you didn't see anything improve... shocked... stick around, we'll get some improvements for you... I know it

 

[hopeforrecovery]

Thank you for that joekool!
But sadly I couldn't find any stories about r-andro reversing shrinkage. Is there a link or something?
All urologists and doctors told me that penile scarring is irreversible, and I'm so scared that it's true.

And I mean to take evening primrose oral with juice not on the penis....

Best regards

 

[eskimojoe]

im currently undergoing shockwave treatment, will let you know how it goes

 

[hopeforrecovery]

im currently undergoing shockwave treatment, will let you know how it goes

Good luck!!! I also thought about it. Maybe I will try it the next weeks, but at first I wait to see if there is an improvement with the supplements. Keep us updated! Hope you see improvements soon!

 

[Ghost]

Well I share in the disappointment of zero benefits... I'm very shocked because it's been a 100% 'some' benefit to everyone who's fasted...

The evening primrose oil applied to penis will not hurt, and I take 1800mgs of Alpha-lipoic acid & 4000mg Acetyl L-Carnintine a day as it's supposed to help ED and repair nerves. Though this takes months so it's a time investment. (Split dosage into 2)

I now say move to R-Andro, the pro hormone to DHT. This will help bring up your androgens and improve a lot including any depression...

Cialis will help too, nightly between 2.5mg & 5mg... no more... you can go every other day too to save money. This will restore some nighttime erections and get blood flow going, reversing some atrophy you experienced.

Man, I'm so disappointed you didn't see anything improve... shocked... stick around, we'll get some improvements for you... I know it

The pills say not to cut them, but do you know if this is just a BS warning or something I should actually follow? I took 5mg for 2.5 weeks and didn't feel much save the first 2 days (oddly). I think those days had more to do with my PT on the PF than the cialis.

So if 5mg daily didn't work, then I'd rather break them into 2.5mg and take every-other day to really extend the amount of time that I take them. Maybe the long-term change is more important than the few weeks on a higher dose.

 

[MNK99]

I think you CAN cut them in half. Years ago a urologist gave me Cialis samples and said I would only need half a pill on weekends / every 2-3 days to trial it. I can't say for sure with every single generic variant (if there are), but that warning seems like bs. Bluelight.org users had no issue splitting them.

 

[joekool]

Yes you can cut them in half. I can only think of 2 reasons why they list it:

I bet it's a leftover Pharma warning because you can't guarantee you split it 50/50... so let's say someone is taking a heart med and wants to split it, for whatever reason, it could be detrimental if some days they got 65% and others 35%.. you know what I mean? Your pill isn't like that...

Another reason, many of the coatings of Pharma help prevent too much jumping into your bloodstream at once... again, not an issue on this pill... oxycontin is an example. So that warning is likely just on everything.

I personally have used the pill form and cut them in half without issue... funny thing tho, propecia is coated, we know... and pregnant women are warned not to touch broken tablets because it can mess up the fetus.. yet we still tried this product... smh

I forgot to mention I used a prolactin antagonist (dopamine agonist) late last summer. I prefer pramipexole and you can google it. A side effect of high prolactin is no libido and also, you may relate, to a 'floppy boner'... where it doesn't feel attached or like it's going to snap off... obviously it's not going to snap off, but it just has this weird feeling.. that was high prolactin. Check into anti-prolactin because it seems, once it's high, estrogen remains high and the cycle stays... a side affect of too low prolactin is urge to gamble...

 

[hopeforrecovery]

Ive found an interesting article about a german Doctor, who tells about curing penile scarring and Peyronie's disease. The good thing is that he also explains that it's very promising to get size and length back. He talks about a treatment in 4 steps, which I've posted here. I used the google translator, so hope you understand the main things.

1. Drug therapy with PDE (5) inhibitors (+ possibly L-arginine + citrulline) and anti-oxidants:

The permanent cGMP increase initiated by this therapy causes a downregulation of the so-called TGF-β-1 factor. This TGF-ß-1 factor is virtually the main culprit for the onset of IPP, as it is more produced and active in IPP and thereby to increased collagen formation with the well-known devastating consequences for the penis such as knots, strong penile deformities in the sense of strong penile curvatures and Penile shrinkage leads. According to our experience, this therapy must be consistently carried out for at least 1 1/2 years and causes an immediate stop in the progression of IPP in 95% of all IPP patients. In the so-called inflammatory stage of an IPP, the therapy with PDE inhibitors is supplemented by antioxidants.

2. Mechanical penis modeling:

Here, the patient learns in practice targeted Peniestreck- and bending exercises, which he can then perform every day at home. The type and extent of these mechanical exercises depends on the diagnostic findings (ultrasound plaque measurement, swelling body phako test with artificial erection etc.) such as plaque localization, direction and goniometric measurement of the degree of penile curvature or bending). Often it comes only through the combination of drug therapy and penis modeling to a decisive influence / improvement of the situation

3. penis stretcher and vacuum therapy

These therapy modules are always used when the penis / erectile tissue has already contracted due to the IPP or whenever the penile length measured in practice is relatively short (<12 cm). By consistently applying this stretch therapy, most patients regain 2-3 cm of previously lost penis length within the next 12 months. Here, however, there are great differences in terms of available on the market Penisstreckapparate or vacuum apparatus, which differ greatly in terms of both price and quality. During your visit to our practice, after identifying your penis size, they will find out what are the best devices for this type of therapy for your needs.

4. Extracorporeal shockwave therapy (ESWT)

Extracorporeal shockwave therapy is always used when relevant nodules have already developed in the nodules / plaques, which can easily be determined by penis sonography. After all, between 30% and 50% of all IPP patients have significant calcification in their plaques at the very first presentation. The number and intensity of the shockwaves and the number of sessions (between 4 and 8) depend on the individually collected findings such as location, number, size and especially the thickness of the calcified plaques. Depending on the individual findings, the ESWT 4-8x is performed in 30-minute sessions, usually twice a week. For patients coming from further distances, we offer the possibility to receive such ESWT treatments on Friday and Monday. It is important that a drug therapy with PDE 5 inhibitors has already been initiated before a shockwave therapy, because based on our experience only the ESWT can develop its full effectiveness in IPP.

I know these steps are nothing really new but maybe with the right combination and timing it could be promising. Let me know what you think about it!

Btw I'm sill doing my protocol (herbs, cold showers, sport, no orgasm) and I will update you every 2-3 weeks. For now I could say that the bloodflow is a little bit better in penis but the shrinkage is still there( in flaccid and erection). I think about buying R-Andro next days.

Best regards

 

[joekool]

Hey man... I believe you & @Ghost has re-triggered my interest in a more regular use of cialis , which goes with #1 so I feel everyone may benefit from the EOD dosage of 2.5mg to 5mg. Not to say 'I told ya so' lol, but I mentioned Arginine in my initial post as it a vasodilator and brings more blood in there during erection. And the bathmate is the safest vacuum therapy out there, so you can definitely see this protocol is very similar to what I suggested already ...

I believe the tissue here is definitely recoverable so you have keep us posted with your progress... it will help many in the future.

 

[MNK99]

L-Arginine helped me in the past. I had some penile issue or injury - with the glans not keeping bloodflow. And I used L-arginine for a while. Later it resolved itself.

What about citrulline malate (L-cittruline) @joekool. I used it pre-workout sometimes and it helped vascularity and blood-flow. I was also on Ostarine though, so I know that helped me cut up more (which showed more vascularity anyways). I wonder if that's also good for shrinkage/e.d. I realize shrinkage isn't "mild".

Oral L-citrulline supplementation improves erection hardness in men with mild erectile dysfunction. - PubMed - NCBI

Maybe stimulants were involved with e.d./ not full hardness too (vasoconstrictors) -- but they only temporarily caused shrinkage for me. Dex didn't. Adderall did. Both raised sex drive tho.

 

[joekool]

Hey @MNK99 I 100% agree... L-citruline is a vasodilator too... an arginine & L-citruline is a great combo... you can't go wrong with either, though I personally give the edge to arginine just from my own experience but they're cheap and I agree with your recommendation 100% of citruline...

along the same lines as your link, in terms of hardness, Avena Sativa (OAT) is also a great herb for hardness... I used to take (and still have bottles unopened) a natural test booster called Diesel Test Hardcore... I only took one in the morning and that's it... and I had amazing erections and can tell the days I skipped the pill... well, that pill Is loaded with herbs so I don't know what 100% did it but it has Avena Sativa and Arginine HCL... when I researched eat ingredient, those 2 were for that purpose ... I don't recommend the Diesel Test now though, as there's some DHT blocking in there, Stinging Nettle and Chinese Dodder Seed which I would suggest to avoid in a PFS state... I've tried it since PFS, almost like a barometer to know when I'm 'normal'... when it works as it used to, I'll jump for joy...

 

[MNK99]

I'm sure the old EAC Alphamine product would work well too. Great preworkout. Now it's just an energy drink.
Maybe NO explode also? I shy away from all of them since I wouldn't need them anyways with prescription stimulants (I don't need heart attacks). Vasodilators alone are probably good for people like me without the extra stimulation from pre-workouts.

There are tons of "energy powders" in the USA tho.

Thanks for the reply. Nice, sounds like a good combo for the future.

 

[hopeforrecovery]

Great infos guys!
But would you still recommend me to buy R-Andro for the shrinkage or is there some protocol or anybody who has seen improvements.
Btw what do you think about these 4 steps of the german doctor?

Best regards