RU / "Mifepristone Challenge" Log

[jinstewart]

Hello all, due to popular demand I'm logging this separately and splitting off from the original thread, from about this point.

Long and short is, we're trying a 5-day run of RU to reset the HPA axis, and then see if that solves PFS.

800mg/day in a single PM dose. Will begin Saturday night (it's Weds now) and take bloods again next Wednesday morning, which will be the morning of day 5 of course, so we'll be able to see what's going on.

Bloods being taken are:

Cortisol
DHEA-S
FSH
LH
Test
Free Test (calc)
SHBG
FAI
Oestradiol
Prolactin
Albumin
DHT

"Before" bloods have almost all come in (except DHT, expecting that Friday,) so first off some "historic" bloods from a while back:

### Old tests - Feb/March 19 ###
Albumin - 45.1g/L (35-50) ok ish
SHBG - 62 nmol/L (18.3-54.1) over range
FSH - 3.71 IU/L (1.5-12.4) low ish
LH - 2.45 IU/L (1.7-8.6) low
Oestradiol - 41.2 pmol/L (41-159) very low
Test - 17.1 nmol/L (8.64-29) mid/low ish
Free Test calc 0.229 nmol/L (0.2-0.62) low
FAI 27.58 ratio (24-104) low
Prolactin - 129 mU/L (86-324) low ish
DHEA Sulphate - 6.79 umol/L (2.41-11.6) fine
Progesterone - 0.706 nmol/L ( < 0.474) VERY over range
DHT - 1.20 nmol/L (0.33-3.01) low ish
#########################

So, on to current affairs then, here's bloods from the other week, our "pre-bloods":

### Pre-RU bloods ###
(7th May) Test - 20 nmol/L (8.64-29) mid range, got higher
(7th May) Cortisol - 411 nmol/L (166-507) high ish
(7th May) Test/Cort ratio 0.05

Albumin - 44.7g/L (35-50) ok ish, got lower
SHBG - 42.5 nmol/L (18.3-54.1) slightly high, but has normalised?? Lol, how?
FSH - 4 IU/L (1.5-12.4) low, got a little higher
LH - 3.7 IU/L (1.7-8.6) low ish, got higher
Oestradiol - <18.4 pmol/L (41-159) HOLY FUCK low, got so low they can't measure it
Test - 20.3 nmol/L (8.64-29) mid range, got higher
Free Test calc 0.368 nmol/L (0.2-0.62) mid range
FAI 47.76 ratio (24-104) low ish but got much better
Prolactin - 285 mU/L (86-324) high, got higher
DHEA Sulphate - 5.4 umol/L (2.41-11.6) low/mid, got a little lower
Progesterone - 0.845 nmol/L ( < 0.474) VERY VERY over range
DHT - 1.79 nmol/L (1.14-4.13) low ish but higher than previous! Note scale has changed.
#########################

Well then, that's me! Gosh that Oestradiol... No wonder my joints are a little achey!

Last of the RU is due for delivery today says tracking number, keen to get started! No idea how that SHBG got lower like that but I'm definitely happy.

Symptoms are the usual PFS collection; near impotent, detatched and emotionless, sleep is for shit, lost muscle and gym lifts are down. Mood though has got better the last month at least, coping better at work.

Any and all comments or suggestions extremely welcome. I'll try and update every day. Wish me luck!

EDIT - 6/6/19 Just for ease of reading the on-cycle bloods taken on day 4/5 are here:

### On-cycle Bloods ###
Test - 29.8 nmol/L (8.64-29) Over-range. Very high, got higher
Cortisol - 1339 nmol/L (166-507) Yes, you read it right. INSANE
Test/Cort ratio 0.02

Albumin - 42.6g/L (35-50) perfectly mid-range, got lower
SHBG - 43.7 nmol/L (18.3-54.1) slightly high, got a touch higher
FSH - 3.52 IU/L (1.5-12.4) low, got a little lower
LH - 4.2 IU/L (1.7-8.6) low ish, got lower
Oestradiol - 205 pmol/L (41-159) VERY high, over range. Was below-range before.
Test - 29.8 nmol/L (8.64-29) Over-range. Very high. Same as above so happy results taken at the same time are consistent with the lab
Free Test calc 0.592 nmol/L (0.2-0.62) At the very top of the range, super high-normal. Got higher
FAI 68.19 ratio (24-104) Mid-range, got higher
Prolactin - 259 mU/L (86-324) Slightly high, got lower
DHEA Sulphate - 11.3 umol/L (2.41-11.6) Almost top of the scale, got higher
Progesterone - 6.89 nmol/L ( < 0.474) This is so over-range they all probably had seizures. INSANE high
DHT - 1.93nmol/L (1.14-4.13) Low/mid, got higher
#########################

 

[RebelWithACause]

Like I said when willylong98 tested his estrogen on RU it came back over 9000, something like that. No reason to worry about that, the dude seems fine so I think just like when you take trenbolone (AAS) the computer reads it's wrong.

 

[jinstewart]

Like I said when willylong98 tested his estrogen on RU it came back over 9000, something like that. No reason to worry about that, the dude seems fine so I think just like when you take trenbolone (AAS) the computer reads it's wrong.

Heh, yes I wouldn't be worried but I've not started the RU yet. Looks like Oestradiol's been on the decline since PFS. Eek.

 

[RebelWithACause]

Heh, yes I wouldn't be worried but I've not started the RU yet. Looks like Oestradiol's been on the decline since PFS. Eek.

Your test is also pretty low, DHT also. So all your hormones are low. Just like Admiral.

 

[MNK99]

Careful with ru. I have memory probs anyways. BUT, shortly after the fast... I went to the gym and lost my items a lot.

Took basic forgetfullness, and personality which were all gone prior to fasting... but slowly gave me some of that back and amplified the memory issues.
But looking back, yeah that was actually dangerous. I wouldn't workout like that now. I'm just saying if it makes normal routine harder, take it easy while using the ru486.

Check these out: -I wanted to attach a study showing this lady had rapid HTPA depression recovery from ru486, she was 27 and suffered from post medication/ antidepressant issues. It helped her really quickly. No idea where that study is or who wrote it. If I find I'll attach.

Mifepristone (RU-486) treatment for depression and psychosis: a ...
Mifepristone (RU-486) treatment for depression and psychosis: a review of the therapeutic implications
by P Gallagher - ‎2006 - ‎Cited by 42 - ‎Related articles

The mechanisms underlying the pathophysiology of severe psychiatric illnesses ... Many antidepressant drugs increase GR binding and/or number in brain tissue, .... Although the adrenal axis also normalized, the 18-month-long mifepristone ...
Missing: psyche ‎| ‎Must include: ‎psyche
Hormone treatment of depression - NCBI

Hormone treatment of depression
by RT Joffe - ‎2011 - ‎Cited by 39 - ‎Related articles
Disorders of the thyroid axis have been closely linked to psychiatric disorders. ..... Mifepristone(RU486) has also been studied as an antidepressant, primarily in ...
Missing: psyche ‎| ‎Must include: ‎psyche

RU486 Reverses Emotional Disorders by Influencing Astrocytes and ...
RU486 Reverses Emotional Disorders by Influencing Astrocytes and Endoplasmic Reticulum Stress in Chronic Restraint Stress Challenged Rats
by L Dong - ‎2017 - ‎Cited by 5 - ‎Related articles
Jun 29, 2017 - Aims: To investigate the effect of RU486 (mifepristone) on emotional ... Packages; Nephrology · Nutrition · Oncology · Ophthalmology · Pediatrics · Psychology/ Psychiatry ..... Physiological or psychological stressors activate the HPA axis, .... the rat amygdala are prevented by the antidepressant agomelatine.


[CITATION] Stabilisation of the hypothalamic‐pituitary‐adrenal axis as a treatment modality for mood disorders
JH Thakore - Human Psychopharmacology: Clinical and …, 1998 - Wiley Online Library
… cortical synthesis of cortisol, such as ketoconazole, metyrapone, aminoglutethimide and RU486
(a selective … such high levels of this adrenococorticoid leaves after it an `indelible psychological
imprint' … major depressive disorder may respond to a modulation of the HPA axis and …


Abortion drug could rapidly treat depression | New Scientist
https://www.newscientist.com/.../dn9516-abortion-drug-could-rapidly-treat-depression...
Jul 10, 2006 - The drug, called RU486, was one of two new rapid treatment strategies, ... Most antidepressants are thought to work by raising levels of the ...

 

[RebelWithACause]

Yea true. Ella also made me kinda weird while on it. I don't remember the whole week I was on it. Although my memory in general is quite bad. But the Ella definitely makes you a bit stupid for some reason. RU probably the same.

 

[jinstewart]

Thanks fellas. I'll keep an eye on the memory issues, hopefully work won't be too difficult. I will try and avoid driving.

@RebelWithACause cheers matey, are you sure you're looking at the recent bloods? Test is even a little higher than mid range on that, but Oestradiol right in the gutter for sure! Waiting on current DHT atm. Could well be me seeing things wrong btw!

 

[RebelWithACause]

Thanks fellas. I'll keep an eye on the memory issues, hopefully work won't be too difficult. I will try and avoid driving.

@RebelWithACause cheers matey, are you sure you're looking at the recent bloods? Test is even a little higher than mid range on that, but Oestradiol right in the gutter for sure! Waiting on current DHT atm. Could well be me seeing things wrong btw!

Ah you are right. Your test is OK and free T too. Nevermind

 

[ruprmurdoch]

Yea true. Ella also made me kinda weird while on it. I don't remember the whole week I was on it. Although my memory in general is quite bad. But the Ella definitely makes you a bit stupid for some reason. RU probably the same.

It makes you ,,stupid'' probably beacuse high estrogen levels. But you will see how women have to feel

 

[RebelWithACause]

It makes you ,,stupid'' probably beacuse high estrogen levels. But you will see how women have to feel

Was def. more emotional on the Ella. So I think it has some estrogenic effect. Or maybe by lower progesterone you get more estrogen effect.

 

[Ocguy]

Heh, yes I wouldn't be worried but I've not started the RU yet. Looks like Oestradiol's been on the decline since PFS. Eek.

Have u ever taken any ai's or is this just from pfs? After the Test if it's still low you can take an herbal supplement like estroven. It's otc for women in menopause. . I can confirm it works great from the girls I know on it, including my sister.. a proper E to t ratio is super important for libido, bones, etc. For both sexes

 

[jinstewart]

Have u ever taken any ai's or is this just from pfs? After the Test if it's still low you can take an herbal supplement like estroven. It's otc for women in menopause. . I can confirm it works great from the girls I know on it, including my sister.. a proper E to t ratio is super important for libido, bones, etc. For both sexes

No AIs, but R-Andro did lower it, then it seemed to get a little better, now low again (just going from feeling in joints there, it's been low on both tests.)

I'll look into the estroven, thanks. Thought I might also try soy milk, but I'm not sure yet. I've been weaning off all my supplements for the last week so I'm taking literally nothing but clean food with the RU.

...And day 1 is tomorrow! I sure know how to party on a Saturday night. Unfortunately I'm off to London for the weekend so might not update until Sunday night/Monday morning (sorry.) Bloods still getting taken Wednesday so we can get a look at what it's doing, and the last of the shipment arrived yesterday so we're fully equipped.

Wish me luck.

 

[Ocguy]

No AIs, but R-Andro did lower it, then it seemed to get a little better, now low again (just going from feeling in joints there, it's been low on both tests.)

I'll look into the estroven, thanks. Thought I might also try soy milk, but I'm not sure yet. I've been weaning off all my supplements for the last week so I'm taking literally nothing but clean food with the RU.

...And day 1 is tomorrow! I sure know how to party on a Saturday night. Unfortunately I'm off to London for the weekend so might not update until Sunday night/Monday morning (sorry.) Bloods still getting taken Wednesday so we can get a look at what it's doing, and the last of the shipment arrived yesterday so we're fully equipped.

Wish me luck.

Most definitely good luck! Thanks so much for going out on the limb and documentation. You're a true pioneer!

Definitely go with the herbal formulations vs just soy milk.. plants are very intelligent and know how to regulate and metabolize healthy E in the body much better than a processed analog.

 

[jinstewart]

Most definitely good luck! Thanks so much for going out on the limb and documentation. You're a true pioneer!

Definitely go with the herbal formulations vs just soy milk.. plants are very intelligent and know how to regulate and metabolize healthy E in the body much better than a processed analog.

Thanks bud! I'm totally happy to take the responsibility but I can't really take the credit, @Boris and others floated the idea and did the research, I just bought the RU and the bloods.

Just think, if this solves it... My god... And also the phelp crew will be so miffed that Hackstasis did it!

 

[ncsugrad]

Best of luck. Hopefully you’ll have some good news for us

 

[jinstewart]

Morning all - just woke up on day 2, first dose was last thing last night.

Bit of a rough night, nothing unusual with PFS ofc, and nothing I'd definitely attribute to the RU. Bit under-rested, bit grumpy.

No changes of any sort to report - feel the same.

 

[jinstewart]

Evening all, night of day 2, dose 2 coming up later. I tend to eat just before 9pm and take the RU at 11pm - the RU leaflet says to leave it that long after food too.

Felt like a 'really good PFS day' today. Definitely doing something good to the little 'sour headache' I get that comes and goes. Mood a little better, conversation went better. All in all, placebo or not, I was probably 5-10% 'better' today.

Morning/nocturnal semi wood (which is getting to be a thing sometimes now) was about the same as ever. Kinda weak but a thing.

Sexually feel meh, like always.

Towards the evening felt a bit quesy (to be expected) and strange guilt/regret feelings into the early evening. Romantically life has been 'a lot' of late, so could be that.

Driving was fine, not feeling worse at all mentally, not forgetting things either just yet. We won't be able to tell if I get a rash for a bit as I managed to acquire sunburn too. Bleh.

All in all, I'm grateful I'm not getting forgetful and I can remember things. Stay tuned. Thanks goodness my memory is great and I'm not forgetful.

(Jokes btw.)

 

[TubZy]

Evening all, night of day 2, dose 2 coming up later. I tend to eat just before 9pm and take the RU at 11pm - the RU leaflet says to leave it that long after food too.

Felt like a 'really good PFS day' today. Definitely doing something good to the little 'sour headache' I get that comes and goes. Mood a little better, conversation went better. All in all, placebo or not, I was probably 5-10% 'better' today.

Morning/nocturnal semi wood (which is getting to be a thing sometimes now) was about the same as ever. Kinda weak but a thing.

Sexually feel meh, like always.

Towards the evening felt a bit quesy (to be expected) and strange guilt/regret feelings into the early evening. Romantically life has been 'a lot' of late, so could be that.

Driving was fine, not feeling worse at all mentally, not forgetting things either just yet. We won't be able to tell if I get a rash for a bit as I managed to acquire sunburn too. Bleh.

All in all, I'm grateful I'm not getting forgetful and I can remember things. Stay tuned. Thanks goodness my memory is great and I'm not forgetful.

(Jokes btw.)

Nice just keep going and remember you could feel better or worse while on what matters the most is the baseline after

 

[jinstewart]

Sure thing Boris - definitely will do. I'm thinking could even be a month before snap-back (if any) happens. Think similar or sooner? (EDIT - looks from Cytochrome's Dexa recovery could even be a couple of months.)

Well it's lunch time on day 3 of 5. Dose 3 coming up tonight of course. Feel a little jittery, not sure why but only a little. Mood and personality though DEFINITELY a little better, more 'whole' and I think more resilient to stress, and maybe the 'sour headache' is something to do with that. I can feel it trying to creep in 'around the edges' but it's being blocked in there somewhere, somehow.

Sexually no improvements.

Definitely able to and capable at work, feel ok driving. Sleep isn't great but that's PFS for you.

Plodding along with it! Had a semi-active weekend walking/hiking, I'll see how it goes down the gym later too. Looking forward to bed for sure though! Just a note, there's a masturbation protocol (forced wanking 3-5x/day) for which, if this doesn't work, I'll bravely attempt for August for the greater good.

As always any questions or suggestions or anything happily received. Cheers all!

EDIT - ok yes, gym was a little bit of a trial and lifts were down a touch. However, work and mood improved a little further even. Somewhat spacey but only very slightly. If I'm getting any premature predictions and feelings it's that this should probably be run a little higher and a little longer. As in, 1g/day for 7 days maybe maybe. We'll see though.

DHT from 'pre bloods' STILL isn't here, hopefully tomorrow.

So yes, dose 3 coming up tonight, will stay in touch!

 

[jinstewart]

Morning of day 4 (Tuesday.) Slept a tiny tiny bit better than previous nights but dick is pretty unresponsive. Mood a bit better though. I wonder if some lethargy is creeping in or if I'm just tired; sleep hasn't been wonderful of late. Which might not be the RU, might just be me off supplements doing it. Very very small bit of libido though.

Oh well, plodding through today. "On-cycle" bloods getting taken tomorrow morning, I daresay results will be next Monday with DHT later in the week. Gym later too, will see how that does.

I very much hope this works. If not, as I said above, might just be worth running 1g/day for 7 days - got nothing concrete on that just has that 'feeling'. We'll see how bloods go, how snapback goes, how leaving it a good few weeks goes too.

EDIT - I'm also just wondering, with regards to Cytochrome, Apr1989 and a few others. Could it be that they do "Thing A" (Dexa or Triptorelin shot) which gives the HPA axis a shunt, then cycle "Thing B" (Trib, other herbs) which then brings them back? Just a ponder, I'm not one for the science here really.

As the day passes I've definitely got a bit of lethargy on the go but only a little bit! Very workable and in-line with regular, listed RU sides. Mentally feel the best I've felt with PFS at least (though honestly that's not saying much) and the 'sour headache' is *trying* to happen, but being kept firmly at bay somehow. I wonder if I'm in for a brutal flood of hormones on snapback. We'll see. I'll stay off supps for a good few days after and see what's what. If we get nowhere here I'm definitely up for an August run of 1g/day for 7 days - then I'm out of money for it!

Keep going guys.