Yura log

[Fazed22]

@Fazed22 btw you said EGCG increases iron. Why the author of the protocol says the opposite?

"Low EGCG (high iron) - Manic, insomniac, gassy, no other vitamin or mineral seems appealing, Vitamin C makes you gag, lethargic, tired but can't sleep, stomach bloating, hot/cold hands feet."

Because it's not black and white, he also said in the last few days to someone "raising ferritin is as simple as taking one egcg pill". I think what it does is chelates it from the liver or where the metals where waiting at the liver, and this can raise blood levels and the body uses it, but if blood levels were already high then it also is good for lowering that.

For me it can raise my iron levels if I wasn't using my iron properly before that, for others maybe it just gets rid of iron and raises their copper levels I don't know.. But I don't get the copper raising effect from it because I think I have way less copper and more iron.

 

[Yura]

@Fazed22 and so can you tell me how and how much of what are you taking?
I think I would like to try 10% dose. Just biotin only 10-20mg max.
I see a lot of negative reviews on EGCG and people say they have constipation. That should be symptom of high iron right? So what is the fix for it? Molybdenum?
Like if that protocol doesn't help with bile flow, but it does push metals out of tissues to the blood. I am toasted lol heh

 

[Yura]

10% dose is
5-30mg zinc
600-700mcg molybdenum
400-500mg vit C
30mg b6
100mg B5
250mg biotin
320-480mg EGCG

That looks like ok to me. Just not sure about the biotin what it will do if I take "only" like 10-20mg..

 

[Fazed22]

10% dose is
5-30mg zinc
600-700mcg molybdenum
400-500mg vit C
30mg b6
100mg B5
250mg biotin
320-480mg EGCG

That looks like ok to me. Just not sure about the biotin what it will do if I take "only" like 10-20mg..

If I were you I would do

20-30mg zinc
800mcg molybdenum
1-2g vit C
30mg b6
200mg b5
30-70mg biotin
400mg egcg


Or you could try with lower molybdenum but if taking more b6 molybdenum is needed after to bind to copper then it should feel energising to you and euphoric

B6 is the one you need to be careful with as it pushes out copper and iron so the more b6 you take the more molybdenum you will need.

 

[Fazed22]

@Fazed22 ok..
ANd can you share how do you take HG7 supps if not all at once?

Thats what I did at first to make progress with hg7, a message I sent to someone in end of august who asked me what I did, basically I rasied my iron with vit C then did the egcg with moly in 1:2 ratio to clear the iron built up. But maybe you have a different situation to me. I had a lot of stored iron in my liver which wasn't bioavailable.

"Well the last month or two I started taking vit c quite a bit and it seemed to be moving my copper around and making it more available, it also raised my iron levels and improved my sugar metabolism. But before this I had an issue with much tolerating vit C because I was high iron.

The other day I felt high iron so I took the egcg and molybdenum no3, it worked and I felt relaxed but the next day I felt like dead and empty, then heisenberg said egcg and molybdeum deplete b6 and biotin and that's the main thing I needed to know to kickstart this process for me and when I took the biotin and b6 after I felt like insanely good.

Doing this egcg + molybdenum then biotin and b6 you will need more molybdenum after the b6, then after that I started feeling like zinc, b5 , vit c but I have just been taking them all separately as my body craves them. Usually taking one of the hg7 supplements triggers the need for something else. Sometimes I didn't feel like b6 after taking the egcg and molybdenum then biotin.

Also with the egcg and molybdenum it can trigger a need for magnesium for me to move along the iron and copper, selenium I also found very helpful when my iron went high, and olive oil good for keeping bile flow up.

But now after doing all of this for 5 days - a week my body is using zinc properly now and craving it much more, compared to last time I did the hg7 where it wasn't. So now with the zinc working it's making progesterone for me and retaining potassium and my face went way more handsome and masculine and I've have been getting a lot of female attention, plus I just feel way calmer around people compared to before."

 

[Fazed22]

Thats what I did at first to make progress with hg7, a message I sent to someone in end of august who asked me what I did, basically I rasied my iron with vit C then did the egcg with moly in 1:2 ratio to clear the iron built up. But maybe you have a different situation to me. I had a lot of stored iron in my liver which wasn't bioavailable.

"Well the last month or two I started taking vit c quite a bit and it seemed to be moving my copper around and making it more available, it also raised my iron levels and improved my sugar metabolism. But before this I had an issue with much tolerating vit C because I was high iron.

The other day I felt high iron so I took the egcg and molybdenum no3, it worked and I felt relaxed but the next day I felt like dead and empty, then heisenberg said egcg and molybdeum deplete b6 and biotin and that's the main thing I needed to know to kickstart this process for me and when I took the biotin and b6 after I felt like insanely good.

Doing this egcg + molybdenum then biotin and b6 you will need more molybdenum after the b6, then after that I started feeling like zinc, b5 , vit c but I have just been taking them all separately as my body craves them. Usually taking one of the hg7 supplements triggers the need for something else. Sometimes I didn't feel like b6 after taking the egcg and molybdenum then biotin.

Also with the egcg and molybdenum it can trigger a need for magnesium for me to move along the iron and copper, selenium I also found very helpful when my iron went high, and olive oil good for keeping bile flow up.

But now after doing all of this for 5 days - a week my body is using zinc properly now and craving it much more, compared to last time I did the hg7 where it wasn't. So now with the zinc working it's making progesterone for me and retaining potassium and my face went way more handsome and masculine and I've have been getting a lot of female attention, plus I just feel way calmer around people compared to before."

Now I don't need to do these #3: egcg with molybdenum on their own any more, I just take egcg, zinc, with a lil bit of molybdenum, a bit of b6, b5, a bit of biotin but I don't take everything together.

Just rememeber its the egcg clearing the space for zinc

Also I would say inositol works really well with hg7, inositol is your estrogen helps use your copper so you probably would want to take that too. And I don't mean IP6 I mean regular inostiol.

This is accurate and helpful:

"Molybdenum and egcg drain b6 so quickly.

B6 drains biotin quickly.

biotin drains b5 quickly.

all that drains c quickly.

c drains egcg quickly.

Egcg drains zinc quickly

Zinc drains molybdenum quickly."

 

[Yura]

@Fazed22 Jesus that's complicated hehe.. But I know this is next level in comparison with just blindly following program like practitioner gives you. Learning those symptoms and calibrating and slowly getting better.
Btw are you doing that taste test with everything or what? You take biotin from 10mg capsules?
What you think about taking vit C in form of sodium ascorbate? Like I am making my own mixing vit C with baking soda. Think it is better form of vit C...
And what about other Bs like B1, B2. I have decent niacin intake from meat, but because I don't eat stuff with B1,B2 I take some..
Anyways right now my biggest symptom is I get super cold. Not just hand and feet. Whole body. Maybe I am just hypothyroid.. Normally I would get into sauna and within 10 minutes start to sweat. Now I am in sauna 30 minutes and my body just gets barely warm lol/ I think now is the time when all the synthetic T4 is out of my system and my own production is low..
But I am taking zinc. Sometimes with molybdenum. Without EGCG it just lowers my copper too much right? Maybe even lowering iron?
Probably shouldn't take even vit C if I am not taking that EGCG with it. Will try to take nothing for now. Before I order EGCG and the rest..

 

[Fazed22]

@Fazed22 Jesus that's complicated hehe.. But I know this is next level in comparison with just blindly following program like practitioner gives you. Learning those symptoms and calibrating and slowly getting better.
Btw are you doing that taste test with everything or what? You take biotin from 10mg capsules?
What you think about taking vit C in form of sodium ascorbate? Like I am making my own mixing vit C with baking soda. Think it is better form of vit C...
And what about other Bs like B1, B2. I have decent niacin intake from meat, but because I don't eat stuff with B1,B2 I take some..
Anyways right now my biggest symptom is I get super cold. Not just hand and feet. Whole body. Maybe I am just hypothyroid.. Normally I would get into sauna and within 10 minutes start to sweat. Now I am in sauna 30 minutes and my body just gets barely warm lol/ I think now is the time when all the synthetic T4 is out of my system and my own production is low..
But I am taking zinc. Sometimes with molybdenum. Without EGCG it just lowers my copper too much right? Maybe even lowering iron?
Probably shouldn't take even vit C if I am not taking that EGCG with it. Will try to take nothing for now. Before I order EGCG and the rest..

Without the egcg and clearing the iron first, I'd say that's pretty pointless in you taking zinc as your body won't be using it properly from the iron blocking it. My body only start using zinc well once I had gotten rid of enough iron.

I think b1, b3 , inositol, b12, iodine are good with the hg7 stuff and was a mistake for him not include them

Ok well maybe try low dose copper then 0.5mg see if that makes you any warmer

 

[Yura]

@Fazed22 I think taking all micros that are deficient is important. Basically keep doing nutritional balancing, but mixing in HG7 with the EGCG, etc..
Yah I will try not taking anything and will eat 100g buckwheat instead of just rice/corn pasta..

 

[Yura]

@Fazed22
Hm this is not positive experience with HG7

Update:

Got some recent blood work back. Nothing really changed. Testosterone went back down to my normal lower levels. Kidneys were fine. Liver enzymes a tad elevated from where they usually are. Basically all the same themes as I have spoken about before.

I decided to take a break from the formula

Going off the formula for the first time since February was quite an experience. I noticed several things:

•This ravenous hunger I had went away. I remember when I started the formula being hungrier, and wanting more nicotine. That went away and it has been a relief. It is like I have been battling this hunger demon to eat eat eat and it's just gone. One of the big downsides of the formula is I have gained probably 10-15 pounds or so since February. About a pound a month, which isn't good. If I go back on the formula, I will need to solve that in some way.

•My muscles and body look better. Muscles pumped up, traps and biceps have more definition. On the formula, I felt like I was getting flabby and soft. That went away.

•Chronic left shoulder pain I had been experiencing for months is mostly gone. I think the formula was creating some kind of liver or gall bladder stress, and this was showing up as left side/left shoulder pain. But it was chronic and never went away. I thought it was these fake sugar drinks I was drinking, but it was the formula.

•My energy levels increased. On the formula, I feel tired a lot. I am always straining to get energy. I pop nicotine all the time and crave sugar. Going off the formula, my energy increased...but it's a bit manic. I am waking up at 3am more, unable to get back to sleep. I used to do gut microbiome tests every few months to help this, but I haven't in ages. The formula solved that issue for me and it looks like it may be coming back.

•In the last couple months, the formula was making me feel nauseous. I sorted out it was the green tea making me gag, so I lowered that from 8 capsules down to 6 capsules.

All in all, I am going to give it a month or so off the formula and see how I do. I need to lose weight. I can't keep gaining. The formula erodes my discipline, and makes it very hard not to eat the worst foods. It also made me flabbier and less energetic. But it looks like it solved my sleeping issues. My original goal of helping my allergies did not pan out. I am trying some ketotifen there.

If I do get back on the formula, I think I may try it every other day, or a couple times per week. I also need to tweak the ratios to solve the shoulder pain.

The stack I was on:
4g vitamin C
7mg Moly
100mg B6
500mg b5
350mg biotin
6 caps life extension green tea
100mg zinc gluconate and 100mg zinc glycinate

 

[Fazed22]

@Fazed22
Hm this is not positive experience with HG7

Update:

Got some recent blood work back. Nothing really changed. Testosterone went back down to my normal lower levels. Kidneys were fine. Liver enzymes a tad elevated from where they usually are. Basically all the same themes as I have spoken about before.

I decided to take a break from the formula

Going off the formula for the first time since February was quite an experience. I noticed several things:

•This ravenous hunger I had went away. I remember when I started the formula being hungrier, and wanting more nicotine. That went away and it has been a relief. It is like I have been battling this hunger demon to eat eat eat and it's just gone. One of the big downsides of the formula is I have gained probably 10-15 pounds or so since February. About a pound a month, which isn't good. If I go back on the formula, I will need to solve that in some way.

•My muscles and body look better. Muscles pumped up, traps and biceps have more definition. On the formula, I felt like I was getting flabby and soft. That went away.

•Chronic left shoulder pain I had been experiencing for months is mostly gone. I think the formula was creating some kind of liver or gall bladder stress, and this was showing up as left side/left shoulder pain. But it was chronic and never went away. I thought it was these fake sugar drinks I was drinking, but it was the formula.

•My energy levels increased. On the formula, I feel tired a lot. I am always straining to get energy. I pop nicotine all the time and crave sugar. Going off the formula, my energy increased...but it's a bit manic. I am waking up at 3am more, unable to get back to sleep. I used to do gut microbiome tests every few months to help this, but I haven't in ages. The formula solved that issue for me and it looks like it may be coming back.

•In the last couple months, the formula was making me feel nauseous. I sorted out it was the green tea making me gag, so I lowered that from 8 capsules down to 6 capsules.

All in all, I am going to give it a month or so off the formula and see how I do. I need to lose weight. I can't keep gaining. The formula erodes my discipline, and makes it very hard not to eat the worst foods. It also made me flabbier and less energetic. But it looks like it solved my sleeping issues. My original goal of helping my allergies did not pan out. I am trying some ketotifen there.

If I do get back on the formula, I think I may try it every other day, or a couple times per week. I also need to tweak the ratios to solve the shoulder pain.

The stack I was on:
4g vitamin C
7mg Moly
100mg B6
500mg b5
350mg biotin
6 caps life extension green tea
100mg zinc gluconate and 100mg zinc glycinate

Yeah because he was on 7mg moly and 200mg zinc daily for 9 months what does he expect... Another guy on the forum was saying he was taking 20mg molybdenum per dose and complaining about being fatigued the whole time I wonder why.... It does antagonise copper heavily this formula so if you run out of enough copper then you will just feel copper deficient and have those kind of symptoms.

If he's looking flabby and no muscles, means he's taken more zinc than his body is able to use so its all getting stored, when he goes off the zinc his body will start using it properly again.

I recently did an intermittent fast, and during it I could really feel my body using my stored zinc more effectively so the effects of zinc felt much stronger than normal. Since doing HG7, intermittent fasting feels way better and more beneficial than it did compared to before hg7 so I need to do it more. It could also be when I fast the pathogens I had stealing my zinc starve a bit which allows my body to use my zinc better.

My friend also had a similar experience he stopped taking all supplements for 2 weeks then he started to really feel his body start using his stored zinc properly, like much higher body temperature, strong increase in hormones etc.

 

[Fazed22]

@Fazed22 I think taking all micros that are deficient is important. Basically keep doing nutritional balancing, but mixing in HG7 with the EGCG, etc..
Yah I will try not taking anything and will eat 100g buckwheat instead of just rice/corn pasta..

So before hg7 I would eat a lot of oats daily from the low Vit A stuff, I really think this does something bad with iron and makes you toxic in it somehow, 100mg oats have 4.7mg iron. On hg7 there would be a lot of times where I couldn't even eat one spoonful of oats and was completely put off by them so I eat them way less now.

I assume buckwheat might be similar to oats but I think they have a lot more copper.

 

[Yura]

@Fazed22 I don't think it is the iron in oats what is the problem. If that would be case you would have the same problem with red meat for example. Oats don't have much available iron.. But they do have a lot of manganese. Maybe there is some connection. It is interesting that manganese is very connected to that group of other metals, but nobody is talking about it on lowtoxinforum at all. Manganese can oxidize into like 6-7 forms. I think there could be a lot of problems with it.
Not to mention when you start to lower iron in the body you tend to start accumulate manganese..
I really like this website Iron Manganese DRI/RDA, benefits, side effects, overdose, toxicity, requirements

 

[Yura]

On that website they have green tea extract in a the same group with all kinds of toxins for the liver...

 

[Fazed22]

On that website they have green tea extract in a the same group with all kinds of toxins for the liver...

Use the Now foods brand one and don't do any crazy doses like the standard dose on the protocol and your liver will be fine

 

[Yura]

@Fazed22 Also don't know what to think about that B6 thing and the idea thait has to be just pyridoxine HCL. Everyone recommends mix of Pyridoxine and p5p if you take more than lets say 10-20mg.
Admiral ended up with neuropathy while on HG7. I mean I am very slow oxidizer. It would make sense that I would take it and it will build up in my body.. I would feel like complete idiot if I ended up with B6 toxicity or liver damage from EGCG knowing that it could happen hehe..

 

[Yura]

@Fazed22 WHat you think happened that the guy Arnold completely turned 180 on HG7 and the creator of the protocol?
It starts here on this page HG7 General Discussion - THEORY - PROTOCOL - DISCUSSION
LOL

"
Well I can share some of my theories.

He's on a stupid high fat high sugar diet. Which basically means his liver is in constant storage mode.

His magical protocol doesn't work despite his diet, but because of it.

He's also a pothead which further enhances how much toxicity is stored rather than detoxed.

Anyhow, once you go off this protocol and do a standard diet your liver resumes its normal function.

That's when all the B6, molybdenum, EGCG (dunno if EGCG is stored but thats what I believe), etc. is starting to be excreted out of your liver.

And if you don't have a proper binder in place, you'll be in world of hurt.

And EGCG is an absolute toxic pesticide. The "copper" effects people get when they take EGCG are because your body dumps a ton of bile to deal with the EGCG.

Acute toxicity > endogenous toxicity

EGCG also doesn't chelate iron at all I believe.

F*ck off, you're the epitome of a hypocrite.

You claim to be some good samaritan, whilst you're exploiting sick people for your own approval and validation.

You claim to be some giga chad who just is a regular guy.

You claim go be ultra smart einstein IQ and above the middle dunning kruger, whilst you yourself don't even know the bigger picture of detoxification

You claim to be healthy and mentally stable, whilst you are smoking pot and eating like a child, and behaving like a woman on birthcontrol on this anon forum

Ngl I wouldn't even care and be here if you weren't actively hurting people on this forum.

This will ultimately culminate in somebody completely wrecking their kidneys and liver and suing you. Thats what I believe.

This is why i am warning you guys. If you're in a bad state health your mind is weak and you tend to be drawn to such lunatics and extreme approaches.

EGCG made me extremely anxious, estrogenic and an insomniac.

I was literally laying in bed popping zinc, egcg, molybdenum pills just with the hope of falling a sleep.

"You just need the right combination" No, you simply don't account for the other 1000s variables.

At some point this whole thing of russian roulette starts to suck.

You are basically become a drug addict chasing the next 'formula high'. Pathetic.

Given your other habits, this preference for mega dosing and being in state of hypo mania makes perfect sense.

 

[Yura]

This is also comment I didn't wanted to read hehe
From Hidden49 nick

"I see yeah well instinctively the EGCG doses seemed insane to me, my body never wanted as much egcg as 2500-3200mg so I never tried those kind dosages.
I do like sometimes taking EGCG in lower doses like 100-600mg if I feel I’m too high iron then it does help.
But I don’t think EGCG is good for bile production, it seems to inhibit my bile and my bile is worse when I take EGCG. And that’s probably from it being a CYP450 inhibitor, my vit A metabolism is also a lot worse when I take EGCG which will probably be from the CYP450 inhibition. I always needed to have a coffee or do a coffee enema to clear out my bile when I was still trying the HG7 months ago."

 

[Fazed22]

@Fazed22 Also don't know what to think about that B6 thing and the idea thait has to be just pyridoxine HCL. Everyone recommends mix of Pyridoxine and p5p if you take more than lets say 10-20mg.
Admiral ended up with neuropathy while on HG7. I mean I am very slow oxidizer. It would make sense that I would take it and it will build up in my body.. I would feel like complete idiot if I ended up with B6 toxicity or liver damage from EGCG knowing that it could happen hehe..

Probably just don't try the protocol lol if you're worried about it so much

This is also comment I didn't wanted to read hehe
From Hidden49 nick

"I see yeah well instinctively the EGCG doses seemed insane to me, my body never wanted as much egcg as 2500-3200mg so I never tried those kind dosages.
I do like sometimes taking EGCG in lower doses like 100-600mg if I feel I’m too high iron then it does help.
But I don’t think EGCG is good for bile production, it seems to inhibit my bile and my bile is worse when I take EGCG. And that’s probably from it being a CYP450 inhibitor, my vit A metabolism is also a lot worse when I take EGCG which will probably be from the CYP450 inhibition. I always needed to have a coffee or do a coffee enema to clear out my bile when I was still trying the HG7 months ago."

Its my comment, it doesn't inhibit my bile at all now just use the Now foods one like I do if you're scared of egcg, life extension one might cause issues with liver because its a stronger antioxidant and higher in polyphenols which is not good for A metabolism. But I think the issues with Vit A are all just caused mostly by being high iron, if you have low iron you won't have issues with Vit A.

 

[Fazed22]

@Fazed22 WHat you think happened that the guy Arnold completely turned 180 on HG7 and the creator of the protocol?
It starts here on this page HG7 General Discussion - THEORY - PROTOCOL - DISCUSSION
LOL

I just think huge doses of molybdenum ,zinc, egcg for the wrong person can be bad which is why I never did the full doses of the protocol and always did doses the same as around what you were thinking about trying.

Like if you haven't cleared enough iron then its not a good idea to be putting in lots of zinc first. I had issues when I first tried the protocol I would feel low confidence, social anxiety, low motivation, lower metabolism, now its hard to say if those were from my copper getting depleted too much or if they were some kind of detox symptoms from metals getting released, but if I did a coffee enema I would clear out metals and I would feel better and more hormones than before I tried the hg7 dose that made me feel not good.

^But this was before I found my own way to do it in end of august where I've made good progress without it causing really any issues or symptoms for me and I explained what I did for that earlier in this thread.