Dhair's log

[MNK99]

I don't think it has to end that way. In fact I know it doesn't. Everyone has those thoughts. Or a lot do. It doesn't need to. Randro will help. Randro and 4andro helped a me a lot. I think Test and Prog is a stilt as Per Helen's discussions/theory and other's use. I am not recommending that. My brainfog and others' as well as a lot if not all mental symptoms of fin and masking true personality, were gone or nearly gone in extended fasting (as a cleanse). Branfog, for sure. The rest gone may have taken longer tho, probably mostly was gone, however* I didn't say that ... bc I did not know at the time, and was erring on the side of caution.
It took me a LOT of hard work, insane amounts of hard work. To beat pssd and to stop suicidality in PFS like a decade later nearly. AND also* the rest of gains too.
That phase was hardest, but it was not thoughts it was planning and it was all day. -- for months on end. And before that it was surgery/ crashing/ unable to even walk.
So my crash was horrific. I work extremely hard tho just to live even before PFS... so I have the work ethic. Others may not, but how does one get it? go thru bad things again and again. Or stop it, and learn that discipline and overcome at all costs, regardless of anything or anyone. Focus on you. It is sad, but it doesn't mean it's your fate.

 

[Dhair]

Depending on work and if it's safe to come off TRT, if I was having suicidal thoughts still, I'd fast and go to work if needed. I know easier said than done. But it's also bad going to work or school all messed up anyways. I had 5% gains or so in a few days., and way more at the end... and actually felt I could heal. Couple mo's later knew it. And Knew I did heal a lot, just a lot of anxiety, depression, and some confidence issues and the trauma made me feel like it was still "maybe". If you can work, you can fast 10d but on and off TRT is not good, If TRT helps good, I am not saying discontinue it if it does. If it's one extremely bad day out of 7 or 10 or 20 or 100, that's not too bad. If it's helping good. If not, something needs to change. Is all I'm saying.

I think there's a chance that testosterone could be tremendously helpful. Obviously I'm not counting on it, or I wouldn't be preparing for it to fail.
I haven't been able to work in so long. I'll come off testosterone in a month or so if I don't notice anything, then I may try fasting immediately. I think fasting would be good for giving my intestine an extended break, and I could slowly reintroduce foods and determine which will be problematic. I think there could be a lot of value in that.
I still think I would feel much, much better if I had higher testosterone. That doesn't mean TRT will help, but endogenously... that's a different story. Of course, it's a chicken or egg discussion, but everything that boosts T makes me feel functional again.
Unfortunately, I have noticed some penis changes over the last year. I have what looks like a small varicose vein running vertically down the glans, and loose skin around the urinary meatus. Also bluish streaks along the glans. Thought about seeing a urologist, but it doesn't hurt or itch, so they would probably tell me nothing is wrong and send me on my way. The loose skin on the tip could be a return of genital warts, but I'm not sure. I have not had sex in 2 years. But I know warts can appear at any time if you've had them before.
Anyway, all that can be fixed later. I'm most concerned about my mental state now.

 

[bruschi11]

Hey man, I know we talked a little back. I never knew of the severity of your symptoms.

It seems like you really have something going on that’s just leading to the horrible brain stuff you describe.

I think you’re spot on with fasting. Maybe just juice fast and provide beneficial bacteria for gut if need be cuz I know you’re weak right now.

. @Ocguy will tell you the same thing... if you were a normal person before pfs- and you have these neuro symptoms to degree you have them. It’s gotta be something internally causing the severity of stress in your brain.

Would love to see you really focus on the stuff I’m currently focusing on and have focused on with success. I think TEI/ ARL will be far too stressful for you with the stuff you have going on in your brain. I think starting with fast, building up gut with probiotics (check my log for drink I’m using that @Ocguy proposed), possibly colostrum, and then using some natural antibacterials, antivirals such as colloidal silver May be able to put u in better place.

I’m going to update my log soon but I essentially cured myself to 1000% in terms of the severe mental, stress, anxiety issues last year. I messed myself up with hydrogen water recently and a solid portion of it came back. But I’m back to basics doing it again and already doing better. Really what I’m doing is trying to perfect what I did last year essentially. We’ll see but I think it’s a really good starting point for all of us. Esspecially those with severe mental symptoms.

Just realize that as bad as a place you’re in, the other side of it where you are in a normal functioning pfs like most of us here isn’t that far away if you take Correct steps. You could be so much better in 3 months if you go at This right. Hang in there bud.

 

[Ocguy]

Most of the time I still think death would be better than this, but I am reminded that there are always new things to try. My dissociated feelings have been more mild recently. Hopefully they go away altogether soon. The depersonalization/perceptual change is bad enough without me having to worry every waking hour if I'm going to lose my mind or not. I do need to be reminded that I'm not going insane.

Hey Buddy
I know it's rough.. here's the deal
First of all you need to run labs b4 u consider trt.. trt gave me an initial boost but then I crashed HARD on it.. like the worst ever place, totally suicidal..(I made contact with the guy selling nembutal) shit was real.

If u do have low t.. u only need little bit like 50 mg. and/or a little bit of clomid (1 pill) every 3rd day. otherwise you could very easily stress your system. Go EASY

also you don't need to inject intramuscular, you can go subq in the belly with an insulin syringe and you won't get any estrogen sides.. trust me it still works.
Go to lifeextension.Com sign up - its cheap 5 bucks for memberahip

and order cbc and male hormone panel (basic) your looking at 105 bucks.. take the requisition to any labcorp and your good to go...post the lab results. If you want to check thyroid order the thyroid panel basic, looking at another 75 bucks

Fix your gut.. @bruschi11 is right, you need to focus on rebuilding at this point.. ALL of our guts are a mess and the fiber protocol is the quickest way to get on track
. Go to his log it's there

Yes Dr Wilson has gone off the rails.. I'm using an arl balancing coach that totally agrees.. she is using a slight variation of. Paul Ecks original protocol.. the actual lab. It's working, but depending how out of balance you are could be rough ride.. getting the gut in shape will totally make it easier on the detox though..

This is where I would start.. don't run into anything haphazardly.. a trt Dr is going to prescribe the normal dose and trust me as bad as things are, They could get worse.. run your labs on your own and post. alot of us know what to look for

 

[MNK99]

--Yeah it's possible TEI/ARL pretty bad chelation effects much like water fasting (tho different too, I imagine... maybe herxing more on ARL, depends on person).
--IF I did TEI 9mo ago, probably pretty crazy effects. Doing it now... completely different, but there was other stuff done then. --And juice feasting isn't totally useless,
-It's just that, I can't be making and buying veggies everyday/ following recipes, etc. -it's too hard, but with help can be done. --I mean I did it, but living solo or in that state, definitely needed help... water... is literally water... harder to mess up* but yeah I got serious impulsivity/impatience issues, that most do not. --you gotta do whatever it takes tho of course.
--It's quite possible Juice Feasting and going to work is more possible. I really do not know. I didn't work, then worked crazy hours... then on and off ... like I said working on cons.

Also hence not on Anavar for me
Could cure me quickly or could make me lose gains for once...
Hence may as well go slow route and just be happy for where I'm at.

Diminishing returns not everything will jack me up 20% ... Otherwise done in like 5 steps.

But doing what you need to ... To fast or use ARL /Tei will make it smoother as Brusch and Ocguy say.

And yeah I feel you Ocguy on that nembutol guy etc... Ya I was there too.
All kinds of horrible thoughts.
First time since a kid I drank a lot too
Also ate gluten and instead of sucidal for 20mins and 4-5/10 every couple yrs it was like 10/10 for 16*-20hrs maybe 250+ days.

It was nuts.

So I empathize wholly w all of you.
So making ride gentler cannot be a bad idea.

And ocguys protocol on wiki or soon there makes sense.

Anavar like test could make things worse.
A guy here doing quite well did go under v bad stress in short time on Anavar and lots all over net with trt but no need to ever assume how you're feeling is always the way it is and will be forever. (Almost never the case).

My crash was v v bad BC of vanity and also a mood disorder/cognition-executive f'n issue [basically that's what they are] and depression there and career stuff seemingly ruined no way out... So they all messed w each other issue but... Shorter lived w serious detox. Hence more progress 10 days and 50 and 100 than 348 days last yr.
I wish I was making all this up but true.

 

[Dhair]

I appreciate all of the responses guys.
Regarding TRT, yeah, it's a roller coaster, PFS or not. Like I mentioned before, I did use testosterone from January - March of this year, but it was UGL stuff and I'm thinking it might have been underdosed. Not sure though. I woke up one morning with a very strong erection and all of my mental problems went away for a few minutes, but it didn't last. I believe it was underdosed because of the labs I had done after. I could be wrong.
If you look at my experimentation, the only things that have helped me are things that are known to absolutely be androgenic. Even if androgens don't fix all of my problems, my experience tells me that they should have a noticeable effect. So at least for myself, I don't buy into the "epigenetic permanent androgen insensitivity" PFS theory.
I have seen plenty of recovery stories online with people using TRT, tamoxifen, and other standard HRT protocol substances. There is a huge problem with people saying, "X has been tried for PFS; it doesn't work." You could say that about almost anything, type it into Google, and get directed straight to PropeciaHelp with the exact same group of people repeating the same thing over and over again. If you venture outside the hivemind and you know where to look, you will see that a lot of people are fixed by androgens/thyroid and related things.
I will probably never do ARL. If people felt that they were recovering from that alone, then maybe I would look into it, but that would be the only thing that could make it worth risking becoming suicidal while on the protocol. I also just don't think it makes sense.
I don't really have noticeable gut problems. I didn't want to ever have to fast, but I can't argue with results, and it's one of the only things that can help a person identify problems with their intestine. I want to design some variation of a fasting/RU486+progesterone/R-Andro/Anavar protocol for when I stop TRT.

 

[Ocguy]

I appreciate all of the responses guys.
Regarding TRT, yeah, it's a roller coaster, PFS or not. Like I mentioned before, I did use testosterone from January - March of this year, but it was UGL stuff and I'm thinking it might have been underdosed. Not sure though. I woke up one morning with a very strong erection and all of my mental problems went away for a few minutes, but it didn't last. I believe it was underdosed because of the labs I had done after. I could be wrong.
If you look at my experimentation, the only things that have helped me are things that are known to absolutely be androgenic. Even if androgens don't fix all of my problems, my experience tells me that they should have a noticeable effect. So at least for myself, I don't buy into the "epigenetic permanent androgen insensitivity" PFS theory.
I have seen plenty of recovery stories online with people using TRT, tamoxifen, and other standard HRT protocol substances. There is a huge problem with people saying, "X has been tried for PFS; it doesn't work." You could say that about almost anything, type it into Google, and get directed straight to PropeciaHelp with the exact same group of people repeating the same thing over and over again. If you venture outside the hivemind and you know where to look, you will see that a lot of people are fixed by androgens/thyroid and related things.
I will probably never do ARL. If people felt that they were recovering from that alone, then maybe I would look into it, but that would be the only thing that could make it worth risking becoming suicidal while on the protocol. I also just don't think it makes sense.
I don't really have noticeable gut problems. I didn't want to ever have to fast, but I can't argue with results, and it's one of the only things that can help a person identify problems with their intestine. I want to design some variation of a fasting/RU486+progesterone/R-Andro/Anavar protocol for when I stop TRT.

It's all good, I've been outside the hive since inception of this, everybody has varying degrees of dysfunction.. at the end of the day you have to follow your heart. And all we can do on the other side is share our story and hope for your best

 

[Dhair]

It's all good, I've been outside the hive since inception of this, everybody has varying degrees of dysfunction.. at the end of the day you have to follow your heart. And all we can do on the other side is share our story and hope for your best

I am definitely not married to the idea that testosterone will fix this. I think cortisol signalling/dysregulation is at the heart of this problem and all of the metabolic derangement that occurs as a result. So there are things that make more sense than something like testosterone. I just want to scratch this off the list forever as a potential treatment if it doesn't work so I no longer have to think about it.

 

[jacknap]

fuck I bitch about my sleep/libido problems but I forgot how bad the brain fog was / scary. I only had like one day where I had noticeable brain fog. Whereas when I first crashed I couldn't 'access' words that I used to have at my fingertips. Wow how far I've come.

 

[Dhair]

fuck I bitch about my sleep/libido problems but I forgot how bad the brain fog was / scary. I only had like one day where I had noticeable brain fog. Whereas when I first crashed I couldn't 'access' words that I used to have at my fingertips. Wow how far I've come.

It's depersonalization, severe brain fog, feels like total insanity really. There is a lack of flow to everything in my vision. At best, everything has kind of a pastel painting look to it. It's been over 2 years of this since I crashed. T3 on the testicles was the only thing that made it go away completely. The fact that I haven't experienced a psychotic break by now is almost enough to make me believe in God.

 

[MNK99]

--Yeah I hear that only times vaguely talking to God (maybe as a kid = grew up tho). After effexor maybe 6mo to a year or so, and also Fin ... part of this yr, times in last yr.
--I had brain fog and then severe depression then no depression but still brain fog. --It was depersonalization, suicidal thoughts, planning, and 10+ other mental affects, like near everything on Propecia help (a lot of them at least). --every category probably.
-I'm talking 145 days derealization and like 210 severe suicidal like 70-80% of that. --Fasting clinic gone sooner. Or if ppl believed me . Once again just like after putting much of past and effexor stuff behind me again - I'm v strong and can say fuck all of em.

 

[Ocguy]

I am definitely not married to the idea that testosterone will fix this. I think cortisol signalling/dysregulation is at the heart of this problem and all of the metabolic derangement that occurs as a result. So there are things that make more sense than something like testosterone. I just want to scratch this off the list forever as a potential treatment if it doesn't work so I no longer have to think about it.

Some days I subq about 50ml of T and get nice boners for a few days, other times my body ignores it.. our systems are not stable. This is why I caution about going all in on T. There aren't any rules, you don't need to go on 250ml a week for a months, or whatever a doctor advises as a set protocol. This is where the things can get bad

 

[lakehouse]

I have your horrible brain mental symptoms as well
but i have normal T

have you tried Super R Andro?

people generally respond well for mental sides on that cycle

EDIT: I see that you may try r andro later

i did 1 cycle and it didnt give me any effects but apparently many people do way better on 2nd cycle so ill keep at it

 

[lakehouse]

RU486/Ella and R-andro are still on the list. I may do these immediately after TRT if that doesn't work. Problem is going to be getting money to buy all this stuff, and of course the time commitment.
If this next experiment fails, I'll be 26 years old and still basically fully in PFS. Hard to believe. I don't have a career and cannot function normally. I'm basically living in poverty. I can't believe my life has come to this. It's truly pathetic. Everyone is surpassing me in every way imaginable. I know everyone has their problems to deal with, but I cannot imagine living 50+ more years. I'm in a prison of my own mind. The last thing I need is a life sentence.
I try not to think about these external problems because getting through the day is hard enough, but it's been wearing on me.

im in the same boat as you.

i want to build a career so bad. but im stick in the... prison of my own mind as you put it.

we got no choice but to put one foot in front of the other

 

[Dhair]

im in the same boat as you.

i want to build a career so bad. but im stick in the... prison of my own mind as you put it.

we got no choice but to put one foot in front of the other

It's so hard doing it alone. Over the past year I have basically begged my mom to let me live with her. I explain the situation to her on the phone and she sits in silence. At the end she always says the same thing: "I don't think it would be a good idea."
No explanation, no questions, nothing. Just that. It's truly horrifying knowing that my own mother doesn't care if I live or die. If she knew how close I was to suicide, maybe she would feel differently. But maybe not. Now I'm 2,000 miles away and it doesn't matter what she thinks, but it's probably the worst thing that she has ever done to me.
So at this point, with little to no support, it's hard to see a way out, and I don't believe in miracles, so I'm not sure if I'll be hanging around. Maybe these things aren't "permanent" but I don't have the fortitude or intelligence to continue to try to fix this on my own.

 

[Helen]

It's so hard doing it alone. Over the past year I have basically begged my mom to let me live with her. I explain the situation to her on the phone and she sits in silence. At the end she always says the same thing: "I don't think it would be a good idea."
No explanation, no questions, nothing. Just that. It's truly horrifying knowing that my own mother doesn't care if I live or die. If she knew how close I was to suicide, maybe she would feel differently. But maybe not. Now I'm 2,000 miles away and it doesn't matter what she thinks, but it's probably the worst thing that she has ever done to me.
So at this point, with little to no support, it's hard to see a way out, and I don't believe in miracles, so I'm not sure if I'll be hanging around. Maybe these things aren't "permanent" but I don't have the fortitude or intelligence to continue to try to fix this on my own.

C'mon , man, contact me in PM. I will fix you. I cant take on many people. But I will take you on and fix you , if you promise to follow what I say.

 

[bruschi11]

For thyroid to have fixed you for 24 hours or whatever. It means you really aren’t that far away no matter what is wrong with you.

I understand the severity of your symptoms and how bad the mental stuff can be, but there is definitely a way of regulating things in short term.

 

[jacknap]

It's so hard doing it alone. Over the past year I have basically begged my mom to let me live with her. I explain the situation to her on the phone and she sits in silence. At the end she always says the same thing: "I don't think it would be a good idea."
No explanation, no questions, nothing. Just that. It's truly horrifying knowing that my own mother doesn't care if I live or die. If she knew how close I was to suicide, maybe she would feel differently. But maybe not. Now I'm 2,000 miles away and it doesn't matter what she thinks, but it's probably the worst thing that she has ever done to me.
So at this point, with little to no support, it's hard to see a way out, and I don't believe in miracles, so I'm not sure if I'll be hanging around. Maybe these things aren't "permanent" but I don't have the fortitude or intelligence to continue to try to fix this on my own.

yeah man 99% of people let me down when I crashed. I'm doing pretty well now. Some people were a god send to me though some of those people were from here as well. Just hang in there and endure. If I were you I would take helen up on their offer or do cdnuts protocol you almost certainly will be better as the time goes on a program

 

[lakehouse]

It's so hard doing it alone. Over the past year I have basically begged my mom to let me live with her. I explain the situation to her on the phone and she sits in silence. At the end she always says the same thing: "I don't think it would be a good idea."
No explanation, no questions, nothing. Just that. It's truly horrifying knowing that my own mother doesn't care if I live or die. If she knew how close I was to suicide, maybe she would feel differently. But maybe not. Now I'm 2,000 miles away and it doesn't matter what she thinks, but it's probably the worst thing that she has ever done to me.
So at this point, with little to no support, it's hard to see a way out, and I don't believe in miracles, so I'm not sure if I'll be hanging around. Maybe these things aren't "permanent" but I don't have the fortitude or intelligence to continue to try to fix this on my own.

Whatever you do don’t give up man.

Sorry to hear your mom did that but don’t give up. Strength and resiliency today will build a foundation for your future when you are recovered

 

[MNK99]

-I'm very sorry man. I was lucky... did get some help but that's against a lot of "counter-helpful" things... --> they will not get it, but get better, despite them.
-Don't ever give up man. @Dhair -- this place was therapeutic for me, for sure. And over the phone... parents just can't see wtf is going on / and often they'll assume the kid is crazy. - the forum... now I can explain whatever... and usually don't bc I find it agitating (explanation), however* back then in crash -- yeah it was pretty hard to be coherent at all for me.
-Also* Like Jacknap said; If Helen made you an offer --- fuck it man, just do it. I would cross the ocean for the help I got here esp in Jan and the coming months/ let me eventually be self sustaining again and who I was before and better in some ways, but work on things that I worked on before*.

-Ppl been letting me down way before adulthood, 21 22 stopped letting that happen but yes*** needed severely help last yr and start this yr... but usually not so much....
--> but no man is an island 100% of the time, everyone needs help some time... no shame in it, and no reason to give up, and if your mother doesn't understand - that's awful but it's no reason to lose it out there, you can still recover. Recovered all kinds of shyt ppl don't even know about, myself, including money, time - which should be impossible, but got more in a year and 2 years than 5 yrs before that at times, and will continue too, esp after this PFS stuff is behind me. Continuing 6mo ago, and now for sure*.
Never give up.

-My biggest motivator in life for yrs was proving others wrong and related things, but also myself*.

- @Dhair there was a kid here very young, told me he can't and he isn't strong enough/ doesn't get it... other problems with his life (some pretty major* and I relate to them);
-And 2mo later he mysteriously got to 40% he did a 7 d water fast (skinny/ lean kid)... and he just got better and better, went back to his university*.
-One person's support/ one friend can make all the difference in the world man, I know that first hand, and also being there for others in their time of need, pfs and otherwise.
-as well as I can / could.

-I had no one dude, I was 22, life was destroyed mania, legal/illegal things/ friends betrayal./ had to leave the country + PSSD all at once + mania + depression + mixed cycling + severe memory issues -- it was brutal. + 3-4 addictions, on the run. It was fucking crazy. Moved to a big city/ slowly got my life on track. That was before this pfs stuff/ finally an adult... in many ways, and looked successful or nearly... and it was taken away, but I didn't let it stop me. It was close*, but Hackstasis and other places/ got me out of it... and resiliency. For a long time/ acted like it was alright, but now it is... it was even longer this "faking it to make it stage" after Effexor/ but no guidance somehow got there or little guidance.
-guidance can save a life man, i know it.