ESTRONE VS ESTRADIOL RATIO as the cause of PFS and hairloss.

[highserotonin90]

This is speculation, take it with a grain of salt:

I think finasteride causes low estrogen side effects after a while. Wether it is the expression of estrogen on the receptor or ACTUAL low estrogen I don't know.

Friends of mine who do bodybuilding feel similar to people on PFS. Joint pain, no sex drive, no erections, stomach issues/bloated stomach, brainfog, anxiety, OCD thinking, bad stools, low confidence, suicidal thoughts, irritated and angry. Creatine also made them feel WORSE - it increases DHT. This results in more competition between DHT and estrogen. Just like me after I first quit finasteride. For some of them it took months to be back to normal. Even when their estrogen in bloodwork was GOOD. They still felt a lot of the side effects.

Similar to how guys have good blood work after quitting finasteride but they still feel like shit!

It seemed the longer they were in low estrogen state, the longer it took to feel back to normal.

One guy told me when he was on trenbolone (progestin) he would still have high sex drive even though he crashed his estrogen to the ground. When he came off trenbolone to TRT dosage he did not have any libido and low estrogen side effects. It could be that progestins can mitigate some of low estrogen side effects.

So if you are on finasteride you might still have some sex drive but when you go off now you are on just testosterone with low/crashed estrogen. When you have been in that state (while on finasteride) for a long time you do not recover instantly. It can take a pretty long time. Especially if you have low T. Because you aromatise a lot less to estrogen. And even if you aromatise the effects of E2 do not seem to be back instantly.

I think this is why people also feel bad on R-Andro a lot. When you already have feel low estrogen you add in a compound that lowers it even further!

Since taking finasteride I have felt low-ish estrogen in general. Even after recovering and fixing brainfog/libido I still feel a bit low estrogen (like joints and dry-ish skin).

This is why a lot of PFS guys react bad to zinc. This lowers estrogen even further.

Two weeks ago I took high zinc (50mg) for a while. I took the zinc with copper. While it did boost my libido in beginning. After 5 days I felt low estrogen. Hot flashes, sweating, anxiety and joint pain. Also extremely tired. This was gone after 5 days of eating low zinc.

I think this is why people react good to supplemented estrogen (+ DHT - probably don't even need it). You could probably take something like dianabol or a highly aromatising compound and feel better when you take it. Don't recommend that.

I think you can stop hairloss but I never felt good on anything that slowed or stopped my hairloss. For me it seems hair or mental health.

I had the same experience, but at least it helped me run less on adrenaline...maybe I didn't support it with enough histidine or was the copper already low?

 

[RebelWithACause]

I don't really agree with what I said there anymore. I think fin lowers metabolism or at least takes away pro metabolic effect of DHT for example. Probably why people get diabetes symptoms on finasteride and dutasteride. Not everyone but some. Plus high cholesterol. Hallmarks of hypothyroidism.

I think also some people don't get rid of finasteride maybe. Another reason why they have long lasting symptoms.

I think explanations from Helen much better. All of it could be possible. Fin is not even a progestin Ressurection also posted about it and I also read more online that said fin is not a progestin.

 

[highserotonin90]

I don't really agree with what I said there anymore. I think fin lowers metabolism or at least takes away pro metabolic effect of DHT for example. Probably why people get diabetes symptoms on finasteride and dutasteride. Not everyone but some. Plus high cholesterol. Hallmarks of hypothyroidism.

I think also some people don't get rid of finasteride maybe. Another reason why they have long lasting symptoms.

I think explanations from Helen much better. All of it could be possible. Fin is not even a progestin Ressurection also posted about it and I also read more online that said fin is not a progestin.

I didn't specify, I was referring to zinc.