ESTRONE VS ESTRADIOL RATIO as the cause of PFS and hairloss.

Helen

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But wouldn't other compounds cause it too since testosterone and progesterone are based on the same enzyme. You take testosterone, anavar, anadrol ,superdrol etc. and LH gets turned off and this shuts down the entire axis so testosterone gets turned off and so would progesterone too - thus causing low potassium, right?

I guess.


Hypokalemia will stop the LH. Hypokalemia decreases testosterone production in male mice by altering luteinizing hormone secretion. - PubMed - NCBI
https://www.physiology.org/doi/pdf/10.1152/ajpendo.1998.275.6.E1037

I know that when you are low on potassium, progesterone goes up
Chronic potassium depletion increases adrenal progesterone production that is necessary for efficient renal retention of potassium. - PubMed - NCBI
 

Admiral

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Yeah, we are just talking details about other stuff. ARL/TEI does everything, it just at a much slower pace uunfortunately.

Yeah. Would be interesting to see one’s blood panel on hormones throughout recovery. Might measure mine when I finish my next cycle to to see if there are any improvements at that part.
 
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RebelWithACause

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Very interesting. I am going to follow electrolyte protocol and see what the results are in 2-3 months. Will take another 1,5 weeks before hormones left my body for most part. I think my estrogen is already on low side. I think this will help with recovery since estrogen is what causes biggest suppression to HPTA.

I personally think most guys that are on TRT and even high dose steroids look healthier then their peers. Especially when older. Most older guys look sickly. While the guys on TRT look full with life and strength.

Maybe because bodybuilders also use progestins (deca, trenbolone, trestolone) they do not have this side effect?

A lot of bodybuilders also fuck themselves up before shows taking high dosages of AI's (arimidex, letrozole, aromasin) and a lot of DHT drugs + trenbolone keeping them in very low estrogen state even for months after the show. Yet they still look fairly healthy after years of doing this.

I am not saying they are healthy from inside. But on the outside they look fine.
 
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supernature

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This is one case of PFS. Low testosterone normal estradiol, high estrone. low or normal DHT.

In another case, we have high normal testosterone, high normal dht, and probably high estradiol.
DHT is made with NADPH. So is testosterone.( which is made with NAD ( 3 beta) and NADPH( 17 beta) I am not sure if low pentose causes high or low histidine levels yet. May be low pentose low histidine. Still looking at it.


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instead of taking progesterone with testosterone to prevent hypokalemia; how about taking a serm like clomiphene or even hcg to let 3b hsd work and produce some prog?
 

freeflow

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This is the same as accuntane and finasteride. If you give fin for one body chemistry. you will unbalance FAD and NADPH, so now you can give accutane to that person, and FAD and NADPH will be even. But BOTH LOW.


Same with Accutane people. they have crazy acne, which is def in fat metabolism. utilization.. They take accutane. Boom , they get rid of NADPH. This turns off all sugar metabolism. Now they have to run on FAD. Boom acne goes away, but hairloss and other stuff HELLO.


From 20:45, this vegan guy tells his experience how he had crazy amounts of acne, took accutane at age 17 and his hair started to fall out. Then when he stopped, his hair never grew back and now he is 34.
Looking at this, hairloss really seems just like a body chemistry.
 

Minime

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From 20:45, this vegan guy tells his experience how he had crazy amounts of acne, took accutane at age 17 and his hair started to fall out. Then when he stopped, his hair never grew back and now he is 34.
Looking at this, hairloss really seems just like a body chemistry.
I took accutane when I was in my mid teens. Very soon after that my hair started falling out so I went on propecia. I was so stupid.
 

Yura

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I took accutane when I was in my mid teens. Very soon after that my hair started falling out so I went on propecia. I was so stupid.
Propecia hm.. Look at me accutane like you, but then clenbuterol, stanozolol, methandienone, nandrolone, testosterone(3 types), boldenone, trenbolone, proviron, tamoxifen. I am sure that I forget something. Then also progesterone cream + 10 years on T4 meds.. Most of this stuff from underground labs which is contaminated with impurities and garbage.. A lot of this stuff is also in injectable form. So you can imagine how bad it is when you bypass digestion and inject this shit directly into the muscle.. I hope that you feel better when you read this.. :) Everything is about perspective. I can just cry all day long. How I fucked the best years of my life or I can say.. Well at least I am still alive and now I know what is important in life. I was last 5 years in very strange place between life and death and thinking about everything by myself all the time for so long. Like some monk in the mountains. It was not fun, but at the same time I learned so much.. Most peole never stopped for a moment. They just gogogo and then when something happends they don't have this knowleadge what we have..
 
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Niles

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I think people obsessing about health and/or hairloss are often using it as escapism from life.
It's spooky how closely our perspectives on this align, lol. I was literally just talking about this with my girlfriend the other day. It's definitely something I struggle with but am at least aware of. It's difficult to find that balance between doing everything you can to improve your health, and allowing your health status become your identity.
 

Yura

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All true, but then you have people like me. Where you can't even walk more than 10 minutes. Your whole body is falling apart literally, you have body temperature of a dead body, zero blood pressure and every doctor is telling you that you are ok. It is in your head.. So now you can't work, you can't do anything. You are alone in this. Nobody doesn't understand what is going on. You know that nobody around you don't have needed knowledge to help you. Most people would just commit suicide or ended up in some institution on drugs with zero chance to get better. I was fighting this like 5 years and I am 100% sure that without internet I would be dead now. I also know that there is a lot of people with similar story. So I can't say like you that I hate health forums and info on the internet. Btw did you had bad acne on your face in your teens? If not than you don't know what you talking about. But I agree that this hair loss obsession is crazy. Especially in males.. Just shave your head and move on..
 

Niles

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All true, but then you have people like me. Where you can't even walk more than 10 minutes.
Is this due to edema or varicose veins? Have you tried compression socks? I have painful swollen veins in my legs, and while it's not a solution, compression socks can allow me to be on my feet all day without getting sore, whereas without them I'd get sore, swollen legs within 5min.
 

Yura

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I had severe POTS or how it is called. Blood pulling in my legs and zero blood in upper body/head. It was due to bad/weak veins for sure, but also due to weak heartbeat, low blood pressure, possibly thick blood etc.. It is unreal that I didn't died at that time.. Now I am like 80% better. I can work even very hard jobs in warehouse etc.. I know about compression socks. But this will weakend your veins even more. I need to strengten them.. How they say it "use it or lose it". That is 100% true..
 

TubZy

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I had severe POTS or how it is called. Blood pulling in my legs and zero blood in upper body/head. It was due to bad/weak veins for sure, but also due to weak heartbeat, low blood pressure, possibly thick blood etc.. It is unreal that I didn't died at that time.. Now I am like 80% better. I can work even very hard jobs in warehouse etc.. I know about compression socks. But this will weakend your veins even more. I need to strengten them.. How they say it "use it or lose it". That is 100% true..

What exact steps are you taking currently to fix your health issues? Are you on ARL/TEI, hydrogen water, TUDCA, electrolytes, RU/ella etc?
 

Yura

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I stopped hydrogen water. I am not on ARL recommended supps(doses). I can't take zinc, chromium, calcium etc.. in doses like this.. I need to function.. But other than that I take what they recommend. I think eating less sugar, adding free aminos + whey protein was the key + stopping stupid T4 pills after 10 years.. Now I have CRAZY detox symptoms from little iodine doses so I know I am toxic as fuck.. Will see on another hair test if mercury, copper etc.. will be higher..
 

supernature

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I think people obsessing about health and/or hairloss are often using it as escapism from life. I know because I do/did too.

I see unhealthy people using drugs and living shit lifestyle with full heads of hair and good skin.

I see people blasting steroids at high dosages whole year round with zero hairloss and good skin. No problems coming off either.

I see guys with shit diet/no nutritional diet with full heads of hair and good skin.

I see bald guys with hot/cute girlfriends and living succesful life.

I see guys with acne with hot/cute girlfriends and living succesful life.

Before you know it you lay on your death bed and you think what the fuck did I waste my time on.

If you have no physical issues stopping you from living life you are allowed to live life my friend.

If you do have physical issues focus on it with all your energy and don't let people distract you.

I do not like health forums because it attracts negative people with a bad mindset. A lot of victims and people feeling sorry for themselves. People dragging each other down back in bucket with crabs. It is a dirty place and I never feel good visiting any of these forums. Even this forum.

There is a lot of good people on here but also a lot of weak and negative people.


...


I am going to take break from these forums. If something good happens to me I will let you guys know. If something bad happens I will too.


...
 
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RebelWithACause

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Iook at that, do you think on RPF people go there because know very much about metabolism and like to discuss about it in scientific way, no their metabolism is off and they are looking for answers why.

Of course everybody have seen a bum with full head of hair and not a single white string, but even if it was the other way around he wouldnt care either, so its the way people like to be presented or the way they have no choice over it or are just totally over it.

Idk what the poor souls around all this health forums can do w/o such an insidious posts like yours, i dont even know how i had missed them myself so far :) Maybe i dont need someone to bump my spirits like that, while rushing to leave.





Plus you dont need to announce your departure, this is not an airport. Instead of staying and contributing you talk positive negative mindsets and energy vampires, what the hill.

I agree that there is a reason why people look for answers and that is good. Because without help and tips from gbolduev I would be in worse spot. Also support from other guys on this forum is good. I appreciate all the guys that support(ed) me. I support them too.

I think there is a point where it becomes obsession and escapism. People want perfect hair, perfect health, etc. Meanwhile you will age anyways no matter what you do. Your skin will get wrinklier and your hair will become shittier if you are prone to hairloss.

Meanwhile you could of put the energy in building a good life for you and potential future family.

Look if you have PFS or other health complication you need to focus on getting better. But after that it is useless in my opinion. You will die. It will be very soon. Before you know it your life is over. I do not think people realise this. No one will remember a guy with perfect health and skin. They will remember the men and women who put energy in the world and built something.

Sometimes I ramble. I say things on my mind. I am a human, not a God. Not everybody is going to like it.

Negative people affect me even if I do not want it to. This is why I do not like negative people. Because their energy brings my energy down. I avoid all negative people in real life too. Not just online. Negativity can kill you and it can keep you locked up. I try to shun weakness and negativity in others because I do not want to be around it.

There is a lot of good people on this forums. A lot of strong and positive men that try to get their health back.

I hope all men and women on this forums will get their health back and then kill it at life.

Peace.

I did not mean to pollute this thread. If you feel like it is spam feel free to delete it.
 

supernature

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921
I agree that there is a reason why people look for answers and that is good. Because without help and tips from gbolduev I would be in worse spot. Also support from other guys on this forum is good. I appreciate all the guys that support(ed) me. I support them too.

I think there is a point where it becomes obsession and escapism. People want perfect hair, perfect health, etc. Meanwhile you will age anyways no matter what you do. Your skin will get wrinklier and your hair will become shittier if you are prone to hairloss.

Meanwhile you could of put the energy in building a good life for you and potential future family.

Look if you have PFS or other health complication you need to focus on getting better. But after that it is useless in my opinion. You will die. It will be very soon. Before you know it your life is over. I do not think people realise this. No one will remember a guy with perfect health and skin. They will remember the men and women who put energy in the world and built something.

Sometimes I ramble. I say things on my mind. I am a human, not a God. Not everybody is going to like it.

Negative people affect me even if I do not want it to. This is why I do not like negative people. Because their energy brings my energy down. I avoid all negative people in real life too. Not just online. Negativity can kill you and it can keep you locked up. I try to shun weakness and negativity in others because I do not want to be around it.

There is a lot of good people on this forums. A lot of strong and positive men that try to get their health back.

I hope all men and women on this forums will get their health back and then kill it at life.

Peace.


...
 
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Niles

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You are focused too much on the negativity yourself that is making huge space in yours recent posts. Everybody knows that there are many good people around here and around everywhere, why you are looking for rewards by talking spiritual stuff as its clear you are not less capable of digging science and contribute to the topics here. What you think we dont know what counts more in life, you probably think that everybody around here, stay and live only around here and have never done anything good in life and have never build anything at all, and why would you think that ?
And you say stuff about support, you prefer obviously support in terms of holding hands virtually and making virtual compliments instead of adding up missing scientific pieces to the picture.

I had the impression you are leaving for somewhere from you recent posts !? or you were preparing for having a brake. Well if you need a brake so badly, take it. While you are away on brake we gonna keep spending some time here while adding value to the common cause.
If this forum's purpose is to help resolve chronic illness exclusively via biochemical theorization and experimentation, then it's true that RWAC's mental/behavioral talk would be out of place; however, if this forum exists to help people recover by whatever means are available to them, then I think that this sort of mental/behavioral discussion is a valuable contribution. While RWAC's calling forum members "weak" isn't very helpful, there is still a lot of truth to the idea that becoming overly obsessed with symptoms, supplements, and theories can lead to unnecessary stress and isolation that's ultimately detrimental to one's health. Just take a look at propeciahelp and solvepfs, for chrissakes.

If anything, I think that this forum sets itself apart from propeciahelp and solvepfs because we are open to talking about these things and thinking about all aspects of recovery, rather than speaking only in biochemical theories. There is a reason that swolsource has a higher percentage of members cured then ph or spfs, and it is because of all of the positive mental/behavioral discussion and support. What makes this forum unique is that we have the best of both worlds.

If one already has a perfectly balanced life in which one can be mentally and emotionally present with friends and family, chase novel experiences, and continue to grow despite one's physical condition, then there is no need to take any kind of offense to posts such as these, or give them any attention at all. I think the only reason one would be offended is if these posts shine a light on some deep insecurity, in which case it's especially important to engage in these discussions.

I speak from experience, because this is a balance I struggle with, and which RWAC admitted he has struggled with as well.
 

Potion

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68
I had severe POTS or how it is called. Blood pulling in my legs and zero blood in upper body/head. It was due to bad/weak veins for sure, but also due to weak heartbeat, low blood pressure, possibly thick blood etc.. It is unreal that I didn't died at that time.. Now I am like 80% better. I can work even very hard jobs in warehouse etc.. I know about compression socks. But this will weakend your veins even more. I need to strengten them.. How they say it "use it or lose it". That is 100% true..
I know you said that you're doing better, but I've recently read several positive reviews of benfotiamine for POTS. Some people did well, also, on allithiamine (TTFD/fursultiamine). Could be something you'd like to consider.