Ihatefin log

[IHateFin]

Nice, this is your first time trying without using RU prior to it right? It would interesting to see how you respond this time

indeed! i was also thinking about adding 4andro at some point since it destroys my estrogen. ill also be taking copper to try and keep estrogen a little too since it tanks it so much. joint ache and get sore and poppy.

 

[5 alpha]

Ihatefin, was up brother?

I just read your whole log to get caught up.

your experience with responding to R Andro better after taking RU is interesting and catches my eye.

So you used up your last 50mg of RU to fight what you suspected was a prog mishap from the raypeat Androsterone?

Will you be running RU again or are these
Randro cycles working out to good to stop them anytime soon?

how much of a bearing would you say lcarnatine has had on your latest success with the Randro runs?

I'm choosing between a month of the mineral protocol, a prog only run (which I view as risky) or a R Andro run. I'm leaning towards the R Andro run and I'm trying to decide if I want to use Lcarn with it.

It's good to hear you are doing good

 

[jacknap]

For me it worked better the 2nd cycle than the first. My third is coming soon so hopefully I don't build a tolerance haha I want it to be even stronger this time!

second cycle starting for me march 15th homie. Got 5 packs to do 600mg for 45 days this time. And overall I'm doing better than before I started first cycle so think 2nd will be better too.

 

[IHateFin]

second cycle starting for me march 15th homie. Got 5 packs to do 600mg for 45 days this time. And overall I'm doing better than before I started first cycle so think 2nd will be better too.

hell yeah man! thats whats up! its gets better with each one

 

[IHateFin]

Ihatefin, was up brother?

I just read your whole log to get caught up.

your experience with responding to R Andro better after taking RU is interesting and catches my eye.

So you used up your last 50mg of RU to fight what you suspected was a prog mishap from the raypeat Androsterone?

Will you be running RU again or are these
Randro cycles working out to good to stop them anytime soon?

how much of a bearing would you say lcarnatine has had on your latest success with the Randro runs?

I'm choosing between a month of the mineral protocol, a prog only run (which I view as risky) or a R Andro run. I'm leaning towards the R Andro run and I'm trying to decide if I want to use Lcarn with it.

It's good to hear you are doing good

i did use some ru, yes, but i didnt use it all up in fact i still have some. i scoop 5 to 10 mg from what i crushed in a baggy and put it in a capsule and down it. i may take some on this cycle too just keep prog at bay while i upregulate dht and try to make estrogen sensative with some 4andro or something.

so far Randro cycles have been amazing! i probs could see myself running it for performance enhancing in the gym once im cured tbh.

i think lcarnatine helped a lot and i will be picking it back up with my Randro. i just took some tonight actually. i want to keep androgen receptors dominant.

thanks, man much appreciated!

if you ever wanted to jump on Randro or something im sure you will be pleased on how you react. my last two cycles i ran with inositol and this time i may not do that just to see what this stuff can do with out it. may do a short cycle like 2 weeks, but we shall see.

tosay i actually took 400mg of Randro so im officially back on. its been over 6 weeks since my last time on and i was planning on hopping back on sunday, but started early today friday 02/16/2018

 

[5 alpha]

i did use some ru, yes, but i didnt use it all up in fact i still have some. i scoop 5 to 10 mg from what i crushed in a baggy and put it in a capsule and down it. i may take some on this cycle too just keep prog at bay while i upregulate dht and try to make estrogen sensative with some 4andro or something.

so far Randro cycles have been amazing! i probs could see myself running it for performance enhancing in the gym once im cured tbh.

i think lcarnatine helped a lot and i will be picking it back up with my Randro. i just took some tonight actually. i want to keep androgen receptors dominant.

thanks, man much appreciated!

if you ever wanted to jump on Randro or something im sure you will be pleased on how you react. my last two cycles i ran with inositol and this time i may not do that just to see what this stuff can do with out it. may do a short cycle like 2 weeks, but we shall see.

tosay i actually took 400mg of Randro so im officially back on. its been over 6 weeks since my last time on and i was planning on hopping back on sunday, but started early today friday 02/16/2018

awesome man

Keep us updated with how your 3rd R Andro cycle goes.

I'll be taking the Lcarn with mine. I figure it can only help.

 

[IHateFin]

awesome man

Keep us updated with how your 3rd R Andro cycle goes.

I'll be taking the Lcarn with mine. I figure it can only help.

will do man!

lcarn up-regulates androgen receptors so should pair nicely.

 

[IHateFin]

update 02/16/2018
started Randro 400mg
felt really good at first. took usual cocktail of sups with it
- boron 5mg
- started Lcarn again
- selenium
- started inositol 1600mg
- creatine 2g
- dash of potassium
- sulphur
- food grade Vit C (not ascorbic acid)

added 2g of ascorbic acid too tho

i took gelatin on 2/16 and 2/17
on 2/16 i felt great at first then an hour later felt a little meh and lack of personality which got worse as the day went on

02/17:
so i woke up took the cocktail again, but added 100mg of 4ndro which is a testosterone prohormone from ironmaglabs too.
i also took gelatin again...
felt good at first then after gelatin felt shit and slowly got to the point where i was a zombie all day. my penis felt amazing tho and i got hard just seeing texts pop up on my phone. so i had libido but was a zombie. my penis felt great! balls hanging low af and i wanted to bang this chic i was texting and kept getting aroused.

02/18:
today i took my cocktail MINUS gelatin...
i also took 50mg of 4andro since i didnt know if the crappiness was from 4 andro or gelatin. i took 200mg Randro before the gym and felt relatively meh but much improved from previous days. the gym helped me feel so much better nd by the end i had the alpha feeling that i love about Randro.
i then went home and took another 200mg of Randro and was going to take 4andro again too, but was worried it was the reason i felt odd so i skipped it.
as the day went on mood picked up! i got excited so i took another 100mg Randro which is 500mg total for the day. at first it made me a bit sleepy so 400mg will still be my max. mood kept climbing and i now sit fairly horny and texting that girl who is just a friend and getting easily chubbed and arrounsed just from her texts and we arent even flirting or anything. scalp feeling a bit warm and a tad tingly so i think im past whatever messed me up the first two days.

question is; should i reintroduce the 4andro at 100mg again? i feel like the reason i was feeling poopy was due to the gelatin, but since 4andro was new i didnt know what was causing it. gelatin made me feel amazing at first, but slowly started fading until it made me feel poopy. i want to take 4andro since @jacknap said a guy got his libido fully back with this combo plus Randro boosts my metabolism and thermogenic affects end up making me lose muscle size so i wanted 4andro to not only give my libido back but also save my muscle n maybe even make more gainz then i normally do at the start of Randro cycle.

what do you guys think? add 4andro back in? @Cdsnuts id like to know what you think of the inclusion of 4andro too since the Randro and prohormone use is strongly associated with your protocol.
@TubZy @joekool and anyone else who would like to chime in.
i already know @gbolduev probs wouldn't approve haha

 

[Willylong98]

update 02/16/2018
started Randro 400mg
felt really good at first. took usual cocktail of sups with it
- boron 5mg
- started Lcarn again
- selenium
- started inositol 1600mg
- creatine 2g
- dash of potassium
- sulphur
- food grade Vit C (not ascorbic acid)

added 2g of ascorbic acid too tho

i took gelatin on 2/16 and 2/17
on 2/16 i felt great at first then an hour later felt a little meh and lack of personality which got worse as the day went on

02/17:
so i woke up took the cocktail again, but added 100mg of 4ndro which is a testosterone prohormone from ironmaglabs too.
i also took gelatin again...
felt good at first then after gelatin felt shit and slowly got to the point where i was a zombie all day. my penis felt amazing tho and i got hard just seeing texts pop up on my phone. so i had libido but was a zombie. my penis felt great! balls hanging low af and i wanted to bang this chic i was texting and kept getting aroused.

02/18:
today i took my cocktail MINUS gelatin...
i also took 50mg of 4andro since i didnt know if the crappiness was from 4 andro or gelatin. i took 200mg Randro before the gym and felt relatively meh but much improved from previous days. the gym helped me feel so much better nd by the end i had the alpha feeling that i love about Randro.
i then went home and took another 200mg of Randro and was going to take 4andro again too, but was worried it was the reason i felt odd so i skipped it.
as the day went on mood picked up! i got excited so i took another 100mg Randro which is 500mg total for the day. at first it made me a bit sleepy so 400mg will still be my max. mood kept climbing and i now sit fairly horny and texting that girl who is just a friend and getting easily chubbed and arrounsed just from her texts and we arent even flirting or anything. scalp feeling a bit warm and a tad tingly so i think im past whatever messed me up the first two days.

question is; should i reintroduce the 4andro at 100mg again? i feel like the reason i was feeling poopy was due to the gelatin, but since 4andro was new i didnt know what was causing it. gelatin made me feel amazing at first, but slowly started fading until it made me feel poopy. i want to take 4andro since @jacknap said a guy got his libido fully back with this combo plus Randro boosts my metabolism and thermogenic affects end up making me lose muscle size so i wanted 4andro to not only give my libido back but also save my muscle n maybe even make more gainz then i normally do at the start of Randro cycle.

what do you guys think? add 4andro back in? @Cdsnuts id like to know what you think of the inclusion of 4andro too since the Randro and prohormone use is strongly associated with your protocol.
@TubZy @joekool and anyone else who would like to chime in.
i already know @gbolduev probs wouldn't approve haha

Hey ihatefin, your libido improvements are amazing. Can you confirm you they were bad before this though? Did you have loss of sensitivity and 0 libido? Do you contribute your libido gains all to ru ? Thanks

 

[IHateFin]

Hey ihatefin, your libido improvements are amazing. Can you confirm you they were bad before this though? Did you have loss of sensitivity and 0 libido? Do you contribute your libido gains all to ru ? Thanks

ru helped so much, man no doubt. before ru i wouldnt say i was at 0, but maybe like 30% on a good day and sensativity was pretty bad, but not completely gone.. it was pretty bad still. now when i first crashed it was 0, but that was a few years ago.

 

[joekool]

Perhaps work a Every Other Day supplement regiment with 4-Andro or Gelatin... like pick one and test it out every other day... see if there's a build up affect that's causing issues...

4AD & R-Andro all perform a conversion and lethargy is somewhat common due to the energy spent doing that... not zombie though so that's a little different... if you find 4AD does it, I'd say try to power thru it with more caffeine or something, if you want the added Test... Anadrol has the same lethargy side effect but it's because it's hard on the liver so you feel poopy from the inside.

sometimes too low of a test base, if we consider 4AD as the test, actually hurts us because it brings us lower than our natural levels... might be too low of a dose... with such a high (recommended for PFS) dose of RANDRO... the calculations may have to change ... and split the dose late morning and early evening... no 4AD passed like 6PM...

 

[IHateFin]

Perhaps work a Every Other Day supplement regiment with 4-Andro or Gelatin... like pick one and test it out every other day... see if there's a build up affect that's causing issues...

4AD & R-Andro all perform a conversion and lethargy is somewhat common due to the energy spent doing that... not zombie though so that's a little different... if you find 4AD does it, I'd say try to power thru it with more caffeine or something, if you want the added Test... Anadrol has the same lethargy side effect but it's because it's hard on the liver so you feel poopy from the inside.

sometimes too low of a test base, if we consider 4AD as the test, actually hurts us because it brings us lower than our natural levels... might be too low of a dose... with such a high (recommended for PFS) dose of RANDRO... the calculations may have to change ... and split the dose late morning and early evening... no 4AD passed like 6PM...

I like it! I think I'm picking 4andro! Gelatin did me great but faded too quick n then had opposite affects.

Update 2/19/2018:
Today I took 200mg Randro 9am then 200mg and 50mg 4Andro and man my libido is awesome! Mood is freaking great! I literally feel like jamming to some sum41, making plans with friends and buying tickets for a sum41 concert coming in April. I also am lusting hard core on this one chick that I need to bang rn haha
I feel warm n just calmly good. Also thoughts of banging this chick and seeing her messages from our casual convo on insta get that adrenaline feeling from classic prefin arousal.

Will bump to 100mg of 4andro with the split so 200mg + 50mg 9am and again at noon

 

[IHateFin]

Hair also feels like silk and has tingles n some normal shed.

 

[Willylong98]

Hair also feels like silk and has tingles n some normal shed.[/QUOTE
Did you ever test cortisol or progesterone before using ru??]

 

[IHateFin]

I never tested cortisol since the only way to accurately check that is through saliva samples through out the day. I've had morning cort tested through blood but it's about as worthless as the paper the labs are printed on.

My prog was very high in fact my endo at the time pointed it out to me yet said not to worry about it... what a dumb fuck...
It was .32ng scale being <.15ng

 

[MNK99]

I wrote in a bunch of extras with my "family doctor". I got discharged/fired. Saw another idiot - won't treat - wants me to only focus on "psychiatric"
I'm seeing an endo in 2mo, she likely won't be useful. I solve my own issues outside the medical and legal systems. Anarchy is true democracy.
They're kidding themselves if they think I'd let some retarded low-IQ family doctor handle whatever neuro-psyche issues I have even without PFS.

 

[IHateFin]

02/20/2018:
Today I feel okay feeling better as it goes on.
100mg of 4andro was split with 400mg Randro. Still not sure if 4andro is good for me yet might drop it tomorrow to evaluate.
Saturday 2/17 I took 10mg ru with some potassium chloride since I was such a zombie that day with a good feeling Dick. The next two days were fantastic. Starting to wonder if small dose ru WITH Randro was the reason n 4ad is slightly harming or helping.

Have noticed a lot of new hairs sprouting from my arm and it started looking darker too last few days.
Maybe the key is keeping prog at bay while increasing 5AR derived androgens (dht and androsterone) to train the feedback loop of progesterone not to be triggered when elevated androgens are detected. Prog is our bodies checks n balance hormone for androgens and it's possible fin fucked it up. If it's triggered while 5AR is already down then it's a broken loop that must be forced down. Could be an idea and I think I will do this; take 5-10mg RU every couple of days to keep prog low and keep androgens ruling

 

[joekool]

You're right about progesterone triggering... we became progesterone dominant post FIN... and it was what our bodies were using to oppose Estrogen, in my opinion and based on what worked and what didn't...

That's obviously instead of our bodies opposing estrogen with DHT ... so as estrogen increased, 2 downstream issues occurred... 1) the pituitary actually turned down testosterone production 2) progesterone was increased to combat the estrogen, which obviously won't help but hurt... and progesterone has a high affinity to 5AR. There's some 'broscience' here because I'm still working to understand why DHT levels were high in Post Fin blood results. But, in my opinion, stagnant and unused due to un-sensitized & down regulated receptors. I found this quote from another recovery and it makes sense:

"It was explained to me in the case of Locks and Keys. Both Testosterone, DHT and 3adiolG fit the same cell receptor as Estradiol, but it is the first three that actually activate the cell, where as Estradiol binds but does not activate the cell receptor, stopping the first three from binding with the cell receptor"

by wiping all prog using RU, I would've also liked ALL hormones kinda wiped out... to not only up regulate receptors but give the body the chance to rebuild accordingly... I remember my last morning of RU was one of the best morning woods, which is why I felt it was time to come off RU because I was resensitized to morning hormone release...

 

[Willylong98]

You're right about progesterone triggering... we became progesterone dominant post FIN... and it was what our bodies were using to oppose Estrogen, in my opinion and based on what worked and what didn't...

That's obviously instead of our bodies opposing estrogen with DHT ... so as estrogen increased, 2 downstream issues occurred... 1) the pituitary actually turned down testosterone production 2) progesterone was increased to combat the estrogen, which obviously won't help but hurt... and progesterone has a high affinity to 5AR. There's some 'broscience' here because I'm still working to understand why DHT levels were high in Post Fin blood results. But, in my opinion, stagnant and unused due to un-sensitized & down regulated receptors. I found this quote from another recovery and it makes sense:

"It was explained to me in the case of Locks and Keys. Both Testosterone, DHT and 3adiolG fit the same cell receptor as Estradiol, but it is the first three that actually activate the cell, where as Estradiol binds but does not activate the cell receptor, stopping the first three from binding with the cell receptor"

by wiping all prog using RU, I would've also liked ALL hormones kinda wiped out... to not only up regulate receptors but give the body the chance to rebuild accordingly... I remember my last morning of RU was one of the best morning woods, which is why I felt it was time to come off RU because I was resensitized to morning hormone release...

So do you think RU won’t work for me if I’m on TRT?

 

[IHateFin]

You're right about progesterone triggering... we became progesterone dominant post FIN... and it was what our bodies were using to oppose Estrogen, in my opinion and based on what worked and what didn't...

That's obviously instead of our bodies opposing estrogen with DHT ... so as estrogen increased, 2 downstream issues occurred... 1) the pituitary actually turned down testosterone production 2) progesterone was increased to combat the estrogen, which obviously won't help but hurt... and progesterone has a high affinity to 5AR. There's some 'broscience' here because I'm still working to understand why DHT levels were high in Post Fin blood results. But, in my opinion, stagnant and unused due to un-sensitized & down regulated receptors. I found this quote from another recovery and it makes sense:

"It was explained to me in the case of Locks and Keys. Both Testosterone, DHT and 3adiolG fit the same cell receptor as Estradiol, but it is the first three that actually activate the cell, where as Estradiol binds but does not activate the cell receptor, stopping the first three from binding with the cell receptor"

by wiping all prog using RU, I would've also liked ALL hormones kinda wiped out... to not only up regulate receptors but give the body the chance to rebuild accordingly... I remember my last morning of RU was one of the best morning woods, which is why I felt it was time to come off RU because I was resensitized to morning hormone release...

i think the reason blood dht is high aka plasma is due to either dhea metabolites down streaming to compensate plus 5AR circulating the blood or its possibly ghost dht which means its detectable like dht, but possibly not actual dht.
tissue dht is what matters since most dht is created tissue specific and thats where the magic happens. dht usually doesnt float its wat to the androgen receptor, testosterone does and at the receptor site is greeted by 5 alpha reductase and is converted upon contact with said receptor. this is especially true for the brain.
you def hit the nail on the head tho! our bodies are confused af and im sure some kind of mineral balance is making it extra hard to revert back to the good old days of dht killing estrogen too, but with minerals being difficult to always accurately measure and there not being enough about the body that is known its hard to pinpoint.

i bet fasting and taking ru would be a way to "wipe out all hormones" since all hormones are reduced when done. i dont think anyone has tried this technique but would be interesting to see.